If you haven't been following general gaming news lately, Nintendo recently shocked 3DS early adopters with a significant price cut to the system in the wake of troubling hardware sales figures in their recent earnings report. Globally, both Wii and DS sales are down 50%, which wouldn't be that big of a deal if the 3DS was flying off shelves. However, in the previous quarter, Nintendo has only managed to move 710,000 3DS units, worldwide. Total, they've sold less than 1 million units in the USA, which traditionally has always been a massive market for the gaming juggernaut. Taking full responsibility for the 3DS, Nintendo president Satoru Iwata has taken a 50% pay cut with other executives taking similar 20-30% pay cuts.

But surely you're asking yourself, "Why is this relevant on TouchArcade," as you mentally prepare your scathing comment to this story. Well, as we discuss in this week's podcast (which will be posted shortly) we're reaching a point where comparing the portable iOS family to dedicated gaming devices is totally appropriate. The era of the App Store where games were described as "good" with the requisite suffix of "for a cell phone game" is over. This last year has been filled with incredible game release after incredible game release. Unity and similar engines are advancing at incredible rates, and through the Unreal Engine we're even starting to see games simultaneously releasing on the PC as well as iOS devices.

So let's look at what's going on with the big N. The 3DS launched with what initially seemed like a strong game lineup that was oddly devoid of first party titles, which historically have amounted to the "system sellers" of the Nintendo hardware family. In fact, the closest thing to a "system seller" to many core gamers was the port of Ocarina of Time, a 1998 Nintendo 64 game, which came months after the launch and wasn't even developed in house. Since then, the 3DS has been plagued with delays and cancellations from third party developers, instilling even further doubt in the platform.

Further yet, Nintendo has taken an incredibly puzzling stance towards indie developers, with Nintendo of America President Reggie Fils-Aime flat out saying that they have no intention of doing business with "garage developers." Comparatively, Apple has fully embraced the so called "garage developer," and for $99 a year has facilitated titles like Tiny Wings [99¢] and Doodle Jump [99¢] that have gone on to make millions upon millions of dollars while still providing a place for high-end show pieces like Infinity Blade [$4.99] to thrive.

The era of "traditional" portable gaming as dictated by Nintendo's vision seems like it could be coming to a close if they don't begin to adapt to what the instant accessibility of both development and distribution of current mobile games has provided gamers. While the 3DS's new $170 price tag is undoubtedly cheaper than even a refurbished iPod touch, the $40 price point of 3DS games flat out feels archaic in comparison. Wired's Chris Kohler raises a point that I could not agree with more: Once you've gotten a taste of the App Store, $40 is not a price point where you'll ever say to yourself, "Eh, what the hell, I'll try it."

Furthermore, as a kid, that price point means getting games only on special occasion. Birthdays, Christmases, or even as Kohler suggests, "maybe after getting a root canal if you cry enough." Comparatively, a pair of $20 iTunes gift cards could potentially buy 40 different games. Not only that, but non-stop freebie promotions has turned the iPod Touch into a portable gaming system with so much content that's available for free that it's an impossible task to download and play it all.

Nintendo is even dissuading customers further from buying these full-priced 3DS titles by bolstering their eShop with a full array of NES and Gameboy Advance games which likely will all sell for less than $10. Furthermore, they even seem to be distancing themselves from 3D with Nintendo's chief game maker Shigeru Miyamoto quoted as saying that playing with 3D disabled is "a perfectly acceptable way to play the games."

With previously successful hardware platform sales down 50%, their new flagship portable struggling to gain any significant marketshare and Nintendo executives taking pay cuts, it's safe to say that Nintendo is in dire straits. As Kotaku's Stephen Totilo puts it, "the 3DS era may not be over, but the era of untouchable Nintendo handhelds is now a thing of the past." Despite all this, Nintendo's Iwata has reiterated that Nintendo has no plans to sell its games to other non-Nintendo platforms.

Sega said the same thing.

I'm not sure anyone (including Nintendo) truly can predict the fate of the 3DS and Nintendo's future portable hardware, but it seems like this is the time for Nintendo to react to the App Store instead of dismissing it at every opportunity. As the lines between smartphones and "dedicated" gaming handhelds blur to near non-existence, Nintendo is going to need to take drastic measures. The 3DS price drop seems to be the first, and as a life-long Nintendo fan I can't wait to see what they do next.

  • Cowboysfreetyme

    I think the 3DS will be fine once the next Pokemon hits. I don't care if the system is worth $250 or $170, I will buy it as soon as the next pokemon drops.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      What does it say about your console, that its fate depends on a new Pokemon game coming out... it's a pretty damning statement about Nintendo's audience if you ask me...  Meanwhile, about 220 million iOS users have access to some 300,000 games on their devices.. downloadable within seconds... *shakes head

      • mark

        Why do you name it "his" console? What's wrong with people. I feel like this article wants Nintendo to die, then half the posts turn gaming into an Us and them situation. 

      • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

        "and as a life-long Nintendo fan I can't wait to see what they do next."

        Clearly the words of a man that wants to see Nintendo dead.

      • Thaurin

        His, in this case, refers to Nintendo. Obviously.

      • Jeff Krus

        I love Nintendo, but the more I hear the smug, obtuse b******t that comes out of Fils-Amis' pie hole, the more I DO want them to fail; just as a lesson in humility.

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        Yeah, but they're trying to compete against WAY better tech with smartphones, etc... they can't possibly deny reality can they?

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001703403928 Lily Chen

        Oh god I hate those claim. Most people who makes them has no realization of mobile processors and embedded techs .

        The 3ds has a better ram in its FCRAM then the eDRAM In the A4 ,although the memory bus is better in the A4 . They also  have a far superior graphic core , with twice the  fill rate  at 100 Mhz then the SGX535  at  200 MHZ ( both core run natively at 200 Mhz).

        BUT the tech specs says nothing without some basic system info. Nintendo has less ram for example ( 128 vs 256 or 512 in apple case) but it also consumes far less ram : There is no need to put a massive kernel that can handle 3G in there plus the base system seems far more efficient then both android and iOS ( I have devices of both of those and they consume RAM on idle like crazy).

        Nintendo doesn't really need the processing power of a cortex A8 core as it doen't really multitask ( there is no need for a superscalar etc.) it does suffer from the lack of level 2 cache but they cover up for it in a dual-core vs single core design ( they have far more level1 cache to use). The main difference between the A8 and the ARM 11 is the superscalar , a better branching system (both are mostly used for multitasking/Threading ), the level 2 cache, a better clock rate and a better floating point unit. All aside of the FPU aren't that much of a big deal for Nintendo ( their system design doesn't really need the other feature and their dual core design is better for the task at hands).

        SO where does it put the 3DS ? well it has better graphics capabilities then the iPhone , that's for sure, it also has a far worse general application (not games) performance . All in all I would put it as a better gaming architecture and a far worse general use architecture.

        We also need to remember that in game developing terms the API Nintendo makes are far better then any of those on the iOS .

        That is NOT to say Nintendo doesn't need to learn from mobile gaming ( better app managing , better promotion etc.)  BUT it can still bring better gaming performance for a much lower cost !

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        And yet that ease of production and extra power has them continue to release rehashes of the same franchises over and over and over, and then pop a $30-40 price tag on every release, garbage or not.  Certainly, Nintendo has had some quality titles on its mobile devices, but by far the content on those devices could be easily replicated on iOS, and a large chunk of it is far worse than the content we're seeing on the app store today.

        Also, irony in that Nintendo doesn't want to work with garage developers because they'll produce "lower quality" content for the system, and yet Wii ended up with dozens of absolute trash carnival games packs that only a 5-year old would see past on quality.  Way to be hypocritical Nintendo.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001703403928 Lily Chen

        I wasn't talking about their titles or the quality of them. I was only responding to a seemingly invalid claim that Nintendo was up against a "Way better tech". If we're talking about gaming that's clearly not the case .

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        The irony of it all is that Apple will probably release a revision that meets or beats the specs on both the 3DS and Vita within a year or their launch.  That's the beauty of a phone that can be version cycled on a regular basis... Nintendo and Sony have to hope that developers can make the most of what they're given to maintain the "10-year plan" most consoles aim for because a yearly radical change in tech isn't going to be picked up by most moms who just bought their kid a new system last Christmas.  Upgrading their phone once every year or two is less of a pill to swallow since it has other uses than to hand to a 5-year old who's going to smash it on the floor a dozen times in its life.

      • http://www.lwry.me/ Matthew L.

        3DS? Yes.
        Vita? Not a fucking chance.

      • BigBoy

        WOW , you seem to know a lot about this. But why i am under  the impression that you decided throw these numbers for no other reason than just look a lot smarter than everybody else, because , you know, this is Touch Arcade not Beyond 3d page . Also care to explaim where did you get those numbers? Because after  quick research  wikpedia tells me that you are way off about the fillrate (pica200 = 400 Mpixel/s @100 mhz vs 500 million @ 200 mhz on sgx 535).So to do justice  , in real world its  800 Mpixel/s vs 500 Mpixel/s ,wich is not " far superior".Besides , as far as i know , the iphone gpu can push up  to (theoretically)   28 million polys per-second vs 16 million on 3ds.That said, even if you are 100% accurate, i still cant find a single title on this sytem that gives credibility to your statment and matches the graphical quality of games like infinity blade, dead space , or real racing 2.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001703403928 Lily Chen

        Pixel rating doesn't matter in 3d as most people think. All it needs to be able to do is to push 60 frames of full resolution per second ( on a 800x480 res that means 23 Mpixel per second)

        Its the Vertex performance that is far more impotent for 3d gaming ( Mpolygon/sec) as its the bottle neck . I don't know where people get there numbers from but the PowerVR specs rate the 535 at 14 M-Triangle per second versus the 40 MT of the pica 200.As for why I thrown those numbers : I hate it when people say stuff without proper research . I work on the embedded market and I often see COMPANIES choose the wrong components cause of market hype.

        Michael said they are up against a far better tech, but in gaming terms that isn't the case!

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        I was referring to the online game stores (eg. App Store vs. going to brick/mortar store and buying physical carts)... As for iPhone.. we're about a month away from a brand new model.. so don't worry, the new model will be upgraded.. and it will again a year after that. Expect a new iPad as well

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100001703403928 Lily Chen

        I do agree that the app store is a better distribution system . 

        As for the new iPhone: I clearly can't say anything about it as I haven't got the final specs and the final product to test.

      • LBG

        3DS has better graphics capabilities than the iPhone? lolwut? Nothing I've seen on the 3DS comes anywhere near close to such games as Infinity Blade, Dead Space, Shadow Guardian, Real Racing 2, NOVA 2 etc on the iPhone 4.

      • http://www.lwry.me/ Matthew L.

        Sooo.... how you doin'?

      • TheAndroid1

        Many people do buy a console for a specific game. I bought a 360 for call of duty.

      • HisDivineOrder

        Should have bought a PC then. ;)

      • TheAndroid1

        The PC would have been more expensive and I couldn't connect to friends on xbox live.

      • BigHugeNerd

        Well, then you bought an XBOX 360 for Call of Duty AND XBOX Live, then. :-)

      • Anonymous

        wow that sucks!

      • TheAceofAces

        Assuming that the 3DS relies wholly upon the fate of one game, albeit a hugely selling one, is foolish.  While iOS and Android have seriously cut into Nintendo's portable dominance and should be viewed as a more than credible threat, I wouldn't count Nintendo out like that.  Nintendo's been around the block more than a few times and they certainly have a loyal fan base.  And more than that, they've made significantly more than a decent profit on the DS family of systems.  The 3DS definitely has the potential to do the same and Nintendo most certainly has hugely powerful 1st party assets to boost it along to get there (not just Pokemon, obviously.  And even if they only had Pokemon, that'd be nothing to scoff at.  Pokemon Black and White versions have been out less than a year internationally and have sold over 11 million units.  So that's like what, 35-40 bucks a pop?  I'm pretty sure if you did that math, any company would be proud of that).  So while I'm not saying Nintendo is perfect (they definitely need to change their philosophy in terms of dealing with indie/small developers and dealing with the threat of Apple in general), I wouldn't count them out of this battle.  

      • vimy

        it says you have an established client based.

    • Mikegenius2727

      Wow...Thats Only a Hot Game if your Two Years Old...No Great Action!

    • poutini

      I agree. Once the new Pokemon and Mario hit, combined with the new price point, the thing's going to sell like hotcakes. I think I'm going to have to pick one up as well. As for the prediction of Nintendo's demise, I think it's a little premature.

  • 360

    just give the 3ds a little time and some software. I love gaming, but the problem why hardcore gaming will never take off on the iphone and i pad is there are no buttons. Touch screens just can't compete with buttons. 

    • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

      For what it's worth, when the original Xbox launched, the collective hive mind of PC gamers openly scoffed at the thought of playing Halo with a controller instead of a keyboard and mouse. I'm beginning to think that it's not an issue of not having buttons as much as it is developers insisting on shoe-horning the controls of a conventional game controller onto a device that has many more unique opportunities for game control.

    • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

      For what it's worth, when the original Xbox launched, the collective hive mind of PC gamers openly scoffed at the thought of playing Halo with a controller instead of a keyboard and mouse. I'm beginning to think that it's not an issue of not having buttons as much as it is developers insisting on shoe-horning the controls of a conventional game controller onto a device that has many more unique opportunities for game control.

      • http://www.vitaltitles.com/ Nick

        I agree and still feel there is a loss of control in fps games on consoles versus PCs, but it is an adjustment.

        However, there are still physical controls that reside in a physical space, and nothing but nothing can ever replace that. No tactile feedBack of the buttons you press does detract from a more fine tuned control of gaming.

        No matter how hard you try, what you do, how easy you make the controls, no plat former on the iOS platform without buttons will stack up against the same game on a physical controller.

        Some people might find it okay and not prefer a physical control, but in no way could it be proven that NO controls are better or more precise than controls.

        There is a reason that after 40+ years of gaming there is ALWAYS been a controller.

      • TheAndroid1

        Kinect? Just joking and I agree.

      • Anonymous

        And this is why you are my favorite on the podcast.

      • Anonymous

        If you were a PC user and wanted to play Halo 2 you had to buy a xbox since it didn't come out pc. im sure If halo 2 wasn't a Xbox exclusive the the Xbox wouldnt have sold as much  =

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      That's never been said before..... /s

      At any rate, I'll take Jon Carmack's words over yours any day of the week... And EA.. and Squaresoft, and Capcom, etc etc etc

    • http://gplus.to/FaustsHausUK Dale P

      You realise the entire gimmick of the DS family was touchscreen control, right? So many of my DS games rely on it partially or completely. And Wii relies on accelerometer/gyroscope controls in a big way.

      iOS devices have both touch and motion controls. Buttons are great for some games, sure, but they're not the only solution.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_SGBZOZI67JW2CJDAIBZ2PU7WX4 Jason

    Nintendo's stockholders are going to tire of this stance once the profits don't meet their expectations. They'll eventually fire the current presidents and bring in guys who are willing to work with the app store instead of against it. When it comes down to it, the bottom line is all that's going to matter.

    BTW: there is no such thing as "hardcore gaming"... haha - what"s so hardcore about playing a video game? Hilarious.

    • sniPyro

      It's the feeling you get when you're feeling an adrenaline rush, dodging flying projectiles, trying to think of a way to beat the boss, your mind focused on nothing but the game - compared to lazily pressing a button when playing Tiny Wings.

      Don't get me wrong, I love both casual and hardcore games, but there's nothing wrong with labelling games as hardcore. Maybe -you- don't feel this way but I personally want to catergorise Angry Birds differently from say, Counter Strike. Just not -quite- the same, ya know.

    • Vimy

      like any art form, the hardcore audience is defined by its demand for a more complex and refined experience. it implies the user to be experienced and not easily impressed or more acuratly satisfied, with less complex concepts.

      a casual gamer is someone who can find enjoyment in a game but who cares not if he plays again. A hardcore gamer is the one who would spend hundreds of hours exploring every nook and crany of a game.

      the design of games take these personality traites into mind. example, the fallout series. you could spend about 15 hours in game and finish the main quest line and end or you could search the wastelands and play through all the quests, averaging 150 plus hours and then add to it the hundreds of user modifications to refresh the experience. many gamers even replay the 150 hour experience multiple times.

      Hardcore means dedicated to gaming, it does not mean hard work.

    • http://www.facebook.com/djamATL Derrick James

      i TOTALLY doubt that will happen; they have made BILLIONS this past generation for the company, and now they are going to fire them one generation later? and hire unproven employees in the company and expect them to get the same GAME-CHANGING innovations that the past presidents got? yeah no thanks; blue ocean strategy worked

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        But look around... MS and Sony have copied that strategy as well (since the Wiis release)... it's time to broaden the market AGAIN.. not go for cheesy 3D gimmicks

      • http://www.facebook.com/djamATL Derrick James

        and despite copying the nintendo strategy, they didnt move anywhere near the units that nintendo made; they are no interested in competing DIRECTLY with anybody and instead focus on innovations that capture a wider audience than the ones directed at Sony and Microsoft; the reason the 3DS isnt selling is not because of the competition from Apple or other mobile devices, but a lack of advertising to the public and not realizing that their market is not being exposed to their product

  • sniPyro

      With the announcement of the low price point of the PSVita, the complete lack of quality launch games on the 3DS (bar perhaps SF4), and the fact that the 3DS is trying to sell through a 3D gimmick that still hasn't quite taken off yet, it's not at all surprising that the 3DS isn't selling well. 
      Undoubtedly the app store has played a part in the low sales too, but that being said, I still think the quality of games on the app store doesn't compare at all to the great games for the DS. Bar Real Racing 2, Infinity Blade (which I still consider mostly a mini-game - a 30 minute experience over and over again is only interesting for so long) most of the great iOS games are casual, so the market is quite different. I for enjoy games on both iOS and PSP/DS, but the gaming experience I get is totally different. I love casual games on iOS, but hardcore games just don't feel great without physical controls. I love IB, but compare it to Pokemon and the experience makes IB feel really empty in terms of content. Granted, there's a massive price difference so lots of people will forget about "hardcore" titles when they can get a minigame for 99c, but there's still that notable difference.
      As for Nintendo selling games on iOS, IMHO no way in hell. There's no way they're going to sell Mario/Zelda games on the iOS. Nintendo First Party games have always had the glamorous feel of "you can only get this awesome experience on a Nintendo console", and the more you release it on other platforms, the less inclination to own any Nintendo console when you can play Mario on your iPhone already. Add to that the low accepted pricing of iOS games (some of us are cheap bastards, and I am too - even though I do buy full-priced games on PSP/DS - the 99c sales that pop up every second day make me hesitate to buy any game from Gameloft), and there's not a lot of profit to be gained.

    The 3DS is looking like it's in a world of pain, but I'll reserve any judgement on sales till Pokemon comes out - that series sells like crazy and it would be interesting to see if some late great titles could save the handheld from dying. As for me though, iOS games are great, but will never be quite the same as a good game on a handheld with physical controls. Of casual games though, iOS remains king.

    • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

      The thing is, the concerns of the "hardcore gamer" are quickly becoming irrelevant to many publishers. As more and more people get involved in gaming, the "hardcore" become an increasingly minority. Remember, "hardcore" titles aren't what made the Wii such a smash hit, it was your mom buying it to play Wii Bowling.

      • Anonymous

        I believe nintendo was smart enough to intentionally appeal to that sort of audience. Unfortunately, that just resulted in ending the "hardcore gamers" being neglected.

      • Anonymous

        I believe nintendo was smart enough to intentionally appeal to that sort of audience. Unfortunately, that just resulted in ending the "hardcore gamers" being neglected.

      • SMP

        I wouldnt necessary say they neglected the "hardcore gamer", they just went outside their expectations, as well as third party companies, but marketing their products to a wider audience was brilliant from the start. As Eli said in his first reply, to the publishers, "core gamers" are a minority, I would go so far as to say a stagnant minority thats only willing or able to buy so many games. Their greatest success has been appealing to a wide audience. So  if the 3DS manages to do the same at its new price point (and some strong marketing), it may rebound. Despite their considerable losses, I think its too early to start saying "Sega" or "mario on the app store", because that hinges on how well they do the remainder of this year and next. Theyve proven to be able to make smart business decisions to stay as a manufacturer, unlike Sega, and not so smart ones, like Sega. On the other hand, Im not entirely sure the 3DS can claim "mainstream" status like the DS, and if it doesnt, that doesnt bode well for Nintendo.

      • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

        I think the biggest issue with the 3DS is that there were likely lots of vital design decisions that directed what the device was going to be solely because of their desire to include the 3D functionality, betting hard on 3D taking off in a big way. If 3D took off how they expected, I'm sure this news would be completely different as Nintendo had positioned themselves into such a great position of being the only 3D handheld.

        ...But, the fact of the matter is, people don't really want 3D. 3D TV's have yet to see any kind of mass market penetration and I think the only reason 3D movies are as "popular" as they are is because most (American) theaters now only show new releases in 3D so they can charge double the ticket price so they don't really have a way to NOT be popular since it's not like you're going to skip seeing the new Harry Potter because it's only showing at 3D in your theater if you want to see the movie.

        I want to see an alternate universe where instead of the 3DS Nintendo just made a better DS.

      • spidey

        God I agree so much. I prefer 2D movies to 3D any day. Most 3D movies are 3D for the heck of it. Apart from Avatar (which was by no means the first 3D movie), 3D has just never been very impactful. And apart from Racing sims, I don't really know whether I would want a 3D game too much. 

      • Anonymous

        I believe nintendo was smart enough to intentionally appeal to that sort of audience. Unfortunately, that just resulted in ending the "hardcore gamers" being neglected.

      • sniPyro

        Yes I realise that casual games are becoming the defining gameplay style of recent times - gaming used to be for those hardcore kids who "stayed at home and had no life", but now everybody on the street is playing Angry Birds everywhere. And that's an understandable thing - you can play casual games anywhere, lots of people find it easy to just pop in and game a bit, then get back to work.
        I just meant that I wouldn't be so quick to write off the 3DS until Nintendo releases some inevitable First Party games. Granted it may already be too late for the 3DS, but when some quality games start appearing on the handheld, that may be when people start to let go of their money and play the next Mario game. And considering that, if I was Nintendo, I wouldn't release games on the App Store either. That would hammer the nail into the 3DS coffin and potentially cut sales of the Wii U too when customers (particularly since casual gamers are on the rise) think: Hmm $5 for Mario for the iPhone, or 80+ for it on Wii U? 

      • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

        You don't potentially see this as a little bit of history repeating? In 1999 when the Dreamcast was released to suggest Sonic would be playable on the Gameboy Advance inside of two years would be laughable. They couldn't compete with the changing market, and, well, here we are.

      • JCman7

        Too be honest I want a 3DS but the price was turning me off now with the $80 price cut I am for sure going to buy one. I think Nintendo made the right move. They have always been known for their reasonable pricing, that is why the DS and DS Lite sold so well. I think it will be much more affordable and people will be buying it.

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        Admit it: you have zero interest in 3D gaming, and just wanted an upgraded DS2.

      • neil

        Not even comparable. Sega went third-party or had to release their titles elsewhere because they were in the red, for over a generation (six plus years). Sega went under with the Dreamcast not because it wasn't selling well but because they simply did not have the funds to continue to push it or be a console manufacturer any longer.

        Nintendo on the other hand has made a substantial profit with every major hardware release. Even the GCN when it only sold 20 million worldwide. Nintendo's business model is that even when they're not market leaders they still make a substantial profit fairly quickly, something Microsoft and Sony have never been able to do (MS is still in the red with the Xbox project and Sony only ever gets in the black after five years plus on the market).

        The performance of the 3DS has mostly been down to the $250 price, a lack of compelling software and the non-push for a new ___ Generations lineup. Not because of smartphones. I know you lot love to think so not least because such reporting is a certain way to generate lots of hits but all this speculative doom and gloom, speculation almost to the point of glee, is always puzzling to see. Nintendo is the only one that has dug themselves into the current hole they find themselves in and so it will be down to them again to get back out. But even if the 3DS doesn't become a market leader like the DS, how does that suddenly mean that their future in the hardware industry or their internal software exclusivity is in doubt? Again, to even suggest so just because of recent events is to play ignorance to the history of the games industry where Nintendo MO has always been to profit no matter where they stand, at the top, second or last. Trying to speculate anything more at this point is rather foolish.

        So no, there is no history repeating because the history of Sega and how Nintendo runs their business and how they currently stand could not be more different.

      • Vimy

        i am not sure if i agree.

        the difference between Wii and Xbox360 sales was in the game sales figures. the soft core wii sold more consols but averaged only less than 2 games per console sold, while the xbox sold less consoles but averaged over a dozen games per console.

        casual gamers dont buy a lot of games.

        as per sega death, it had more to do with EA.Sports than anything else. EA sports cut its teeth and became a player thanks to Sega genesis but immediately after the genesis, refused to do business with Sega, suporting Nintendo and later PS. 

        this killed Sega because they had no Sport titles worth a damn as EA had become king of the mountain and sport titles were king in those days.

        Nintendo s draw, as far as i am concerned, is largly do to its Mario - Zelda - Pokemon crapola, which has a huge global audience and will likely continue to be successful. if they let these go, then it is likly that the console sales would collapse outright. they need to protect these IP's or in the long run they will collapse. 

        Sega, on the other hand, had already collapsed and rebuilt itself by being a software developer exclusivly.

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        By the way, Nintendo's last quarter was ugly... they can't keep humping the same 2 or 3 franchises and players are voting with their dollars. Bringing Mario World to iPhone might not even help them that much.

      • http://www.lwry.me/ Matthew L.

        Their '2 or 3' franchises are the biggest in the world. Nothing even compares to the franchises Nintendo owns; don't underestimate them.

      • Wim Lauryssen

        This. A thousand times this.Consequently, I am done reading this website. It's always been written from an iOS fanboy point of view but reporting has pretty much taken a turn for the worse these last couple of weeks.It just seems that the focus of the newsposts has shifted from reporting on iOS titles to reporting how much the rest of the gaming industry is going to fail because Apple is taking over both the handheld and the console business. I can get my news elsewhere from now on, all I seem to be able to get here is Apple propaganda and mostly people who just seem too happy to agree with everything that's being posted, no matter how uninformed or biased it is.

      • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

        Peace out bro.

      • Daniel Short

        He's right.. I didn't start coming to this site to read uninformed "journalism", or silly opinion pieces that are tied to your site's main focus as an afterthought. Please stick to reviewing games, as articles like this have been cluttering up the site and taking away from what you guys actually do well. If you find yourself having to defend the relevance of an article before you've even finished it, you are probably reaching a little too far.

        And the "peace bro" attitude is a pretty obnoxious one to have when viewers of your site are losing interest fast and giving useful criticism as they walk out the door.

      • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

        Since we've ramped up our staff, we've not only been reviewing more games than we ever have before, but it has also allowed us to fill the site with relevant industry news to make TouchArcade a better daily read. Looking at site analytics, it seems that our steadily increasing traffic would suggest that people like our new varied content, or they wouldn't be coming back and we wouldn't be attracting so many new visitors.

        I don't have much interest in catering to the dramatic vocal minority. Looking at Wim Lauryssen's comment history, he seems to exclusively come here to complain about editorial decisions and accuse of of shilling, so it's not much of a loss.

        Furthermore, if you are truly offended by reading anything that isn't a review, you can just use this URL to access TouchArcade from now on: http://toucharcade.com/category/reviews/

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000466725810 Dan Short

        That URL is a big help, thanks. This is my go-to site for iOS reviews, so it really has been a pain lately to try to zero in on the new games. I can totally appreciate you guys trying to take the site to the next level, but you certainly have to understand that for users who have been coming here for a specific purpose over the years, all of this other content might not be that intriguing or useful.

        So again, thanks!

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        Good point :D

      • http://twitter.com/The_Unflattered Gee Lampa

        Right, but it isn't Wii bowling that has people lining up overnight, either. It's games like COD and Battlefield.

      • Vimy

        its also, believe it or not, (i had to be convinced by colleagues cause i didn't believe it but), its also, Super Mario and Zelda and such that gets people in line overnight.

      • http://www.lwry.me/ Matthew L.

        Super Mario and Zelda are the first and second biggest franchises in the world, so I'm shocked you had to be convinced of that. Never owned a Nintendo console?

      • http://twitter.com/The_Unflattered Gee Lampa

        Right, but it isn't Wii bowling that has people lining up overnight, either. It's games like COD and Battlefield.

      • Mr. Rational

        As TouchArcade of course it's your job and in your interest to preach this viewpoint. iOS and Android gaming is becoming a bigger part of the gaming industry but "hardcore" games (eg. non iOS games) are certainly not the minority. The $ and focus is still within the traditional gaming segments.
        Just look at the revenues from some of AAA titles, GTA4 $500 million during week one launch, New Super Mario Brothers (DS) with around $750 million lifetime sales, and very recently Call of Duty Black Ops with over $1 billion in sales in 6 weeks.

        Nothing on the iOS comes even remotely close to the revenue potential of AAA "hardcore" titles. iOS gamers expect cheap games, not something that appeals the top quality game developers.

        To put things in perspective, even though sales of 3DS games have been quite poor so far with only 2 million+ titles, which roughly translates to $40+ million in sales each for the two titles, minor sales number for "hardcore" games, but how many $40 million plus sales title can you find on the iOS? It takes a very rare absolute run a way success on the iOS to match the sales of mediocre "hardcore" games.

        So it's not exactly surprising nobody is putting in the effort to develop AAA quality games on the iOS

      • Anonymous

        You're right of course.

        But if the games companies are interested in profit from minimal development costs than the AppStore makes a lot of sense. This also seems to be where the customers are keen on spending money, small expense, short game. Which is a pity if you like deep AAA title games made with huge development budgets.Infinity Blade made $11 million in six months. Anyone know how much that cost to make? Probably not much compared to most console games; it's fairly simplistic structurally and the engine was already made. 

        I want serious long single player games, which is increasingly hard to find I might add, but the teens I see getting into gaming now have short attention spans generally and want 'new' games all the time, and would never spend months trying to finish an awesome title like we did years ago, they'll just move onto the next game.

        Things are changing. 

      • Stevenmilligan

        This post made me sad. I miss the old days. ;)

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        I hate to tell you this, but a previous story this week had console gaming making up only 40% of this generation's current sales numbers, which is why companies like EA are quickly turning their focus onto the ever growing iPad and mobile phone gaming market.  One Call of Duty or GTA a year is fabulous for that particular company, and I'm sure they'll keep churning them out as long as those numbers hold, but it in no way represents the gaming industry as a whole.

      • Mr. Rational

        I've seen that article. Consoles are 40% of game sales, but that don't mean the other 60% is iOS. The other 60% is PC gaming, MMO, portable consoles etc.

        I've seen several articles on AppleInsider that stated the Apple App Store 2010 revenue is around $1.78 billion, what percentage of that is gaming?? To put this in perspective, just MMO game revenue is around $2 billion with World of Warcraft with over $1 billion in revenue.

        Yeah, console sales is only 40%, but only a small % of that other 60 belongs to iOS.

        Of course iPad is EA's fastest growing segment, when you have such a small base it's not hard to grow fast.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        The point to be made was that consoles are becoming a smaller portion of sales, while alternative sources are rising.  I never once said that iOS was 60% of the market.  Facebook alone is likely 3-5x the iOS sales market right now, despite being "free to play" games.  But that is most definitely having a head turning effect on the industry and where it is investing its money, for better or for worse.

  • Anonymous

    Nobody would say that the 3DS launched with a strong lineup. NOBODY. I think that is the biggest reason why it is failing. Developers failed to meet the mark, simply thinking of time instead of quality. (except for a few exceptions). As truly good games like Super Mario 3D world, Kid Icarus and others come along, with this very low price point, I think Nintendo can still pull it off. As more of the general public starts to gain interest, so do the 3rd party developers, who will undoubtedly create good titles as well.

    Also this is my stance on the price point: I think it's more the PSVita. This may just be me, but I've yet to come across an iOS game that has truly captivated me for long periods of time. It always seems like it's always just a short burst of fun for me, despite how long or gorgeous the game is. iOS games seem to always fail in story telling and the subtle and indescribable feeling of depth in the games. The price point also has to do with this for me. I can just think- I only paid 99c for this game, I don't really need to try that hard to love it. While on the other hand, if you pay for a psp or ds game, they're more expensive, giving that pressure to try to love it. And like many other things, with time, you'll start enjoying it.

    Just my 2 cents :)

    • Steve

      I agree on both points. I haven't bought a 3DS simply because there are no games available that I'm interested in. I plan to buy it once Mario 3D and Luigi's Mansion 2 are released.

      I love iOS games also but I only play them for 5-15 minutes at a time. When I play games on a console or DS I usually play them for hours at a time.

    • http://twitter.com/dowerchin Dower Chin

      I agree with your comments. My son saved up for a year to buy the 3DS on launch day, but I didn't find anything that compelled me to even consider it. In my opinion, they wanted too much for the 3DS, $250 seems a bit much, when you think something like the DSiXL, with two big screens is only $200, I also found the screens a bit too small for my old eyes, DSiXL is much more my style these days. 

      The only title that looked mildly interesting was Pilot Wings, but seriously? That was the best Nintendo could do at launch? The other titles weren't stunners either. My son ended up buy Lego Star Wars, and Ghost Recon. Both were ok, but not something I'd want to put down $40 for each! The only reason he got two was the launch deals that Best Buy had, I think it was Buy one get one free. The 3D is nifty, but I don't think it's a necessity... In comparison to IOS, Apple did well to pay attention to the development community and embrace the "garage developers". But I'll have to say the lack of real controls on the IOS platform make it hard to really play certain games. For example, I bought Mega Man for my iPhone, and I couldn't get past the first stage, which is pathetic... It's just I can't play properly without a real D-Pad! Sure, it might be an adjustment, but I like play games, not adjusting. So I don't think Nintendo is in any real danger of dying out. But their platform is taking a bit to pick up. The price cut will help, but the real value will become apparent once their new lineup appears to make it worthwhile... But the $40 still hurts. 

      • Anonymous

        I honestly don't have a 3DS yet (though I will now because of the price cut) and was going to wait it out till the 3DS XL assuming they make one. I saw the DSiXL first hand, and that would be an appropriate size. Except it's not exactly the most portable. But on the other hand, I really hope that nintendo doesn't follow apple's ridiculous trend of releasing a new version of their product every year. I hate that about apple- but people are dedicated enough to buy them anyways.

        Yeah, the only titles that looked good were SF:IV and Pilot Wings, but it was clear that wasn't taking advantage of the console. It would've been much better if nintendo waited a while before releasing- a first impression is important!

        I wholeheartedly agree with you with the controls. I have mega man too, but was extremely disappointed at the difficulty of the game, simply because of the controls. (landscape update made it a little more passable), but there are so many games that I play and think, this NEEDS physical controls.

        Yup, 40$ is a lot, but in some cases, it's worth it. But being a high school student, managing life's fees with Christmas and birthday money is tough. Thankfully amazon and ebay save me a few bucks :)

  • http://twitter.com/porsupah Porsupah

    Ow. I'd heard about the price cut, obviously, and seen plenty of speculation that it had been triggered by low sales - but I hadn't expected numbers quite that grisly. Whichever way you consider it, that's terrible going.

    Will Nintendo be able to spring back from this? Five years ago, no problem - but now, the handheld gaming arena is so very different, with, as we see above, far fewer people being particularly motivated to pick up a portable device that's designed for only one task, versus one that's something you're likely to have on you anyway, and can also run some impressive games; and for much less money per title - not a small matter, given prevailing financial conditions.

    I hear echos of other companies that led their markets, and then realised, rather late, that things were indeed changing: Nokia, RIM, Palm..

    • Blueknight1st

      At $170 the 3DS is a bit more attractive but I still won't be buying one. Nor will I be getting the PSVita. As you stated I'm not willing to buy a unitasker when I have a nice multitasker right in my pocket pretty much at all times.

      I'm gonna laugh when the price drop doesn't help sales and the 3DS flops just as hard as the Virtualboy.

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        Does Nintendo not get that... everyone has a smartphone now? In JP and USA. What the F are they thinking... Start making iOS and Android games. If your DS hardware is so much better, then you can include bonus features/levels in there. At any rate, they're all touch-screens, so the UI shouldn't be that different...

        in almost every respect, a new Android phone or iPhone 5 is better than the DS. ...

        Oh yeah, the DS has 2 screens.. I forgot ...hmmm... that's annoying

  • C.Hannum

    That comment in the story about the price point and kids is oh so true. Both my children have access to iOS devices, and both have their Nintendo DSs. They get maybe three or so new DS games in a year (and none since last Christmas). Conversely, there's enough cheap and free fare that I use new games on the iPad as training incentives with the 3 y.o.. 

    Nintendo really missed the boat with the underwhelming 3DS, and I'm someone who owned an original NES and Gameboy (and most of the iterations since). It's now a race of converging slopes: will Nintendo adjust developer and pricing strategies fast enough to come down to where the masses' attentions are gathering, or will consumers and developers push volume and pricing of the app store upward enough that it does start to attract more and more tier one products? If Nintendo doesn't beat Apple to that sweet spot first, it'll be damn close to lights out.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_CW2JNUCX2VCPPTZ6VVHWFKQE4Q Lance Uppercut

    Nintendo isn't in grave danger, but their bulletproof lineup of portables is suddenly vulnerable.  The iPhone/iPad unlocked a whole new market of non-gamers to expose to gaming, and I don't think even Apple was expecting the success of casual AND core gaming on the iOS when they first came out with the iPhone.  If Nintendo wants to get serious once again, they need to look at what digital distribution fronts like the App Store and Steam are doing right.  There will always be a place for hardcore games, but smaller, cheaper games are much more profitable these days.

    I certainly wasn't expecting my iPad to become my new portable gaming device, but now I've got more gaming apps than I do other kinds of apps.  Its multifunctionality and cheap game prices have won me over, and the game selection is really starting to mature and find its own way.  I'll probably be springing the money for a new model iPad instead of the Vita or 3DS, and this is coming from a hardcore PC gamer.

    • Steve

      "... I don't think even Apple was expecting the success of casual AND core gaming on the iOS when they first came out with the iPhone."

      Apple didn't even want to allow developers to make 3rd party apps when the iPhone was originally released. Once hackers proved there was a huge demand for it they caved in.

      • Hello

        Dumbass. Their SDK was in complete since the 1.0 firmware. They had to develop mass APIs such as porting OpenGL ES as an API to developers so they could develop these 3D games it's not because of jailbreaking they said "there's a demand for a store to sell crappy games found on Installer" Apple had already planned for the future

  • http://twitter.com/cascadiagames Cascadia Games LLC

    I like this article. My son is only 6 months, but let's say he was 10
    years old. You think I'd buy him a 3DS or an iPod? Obviously, I would go
    with the latter -- he can get Sega All Stars Racing for $2.99 instead
    of Mario Kart for $29.99.

    My parents had to gamble $80 per cartridge on games like "King of
    Monsters" when I was a kid, only for me to be disappointed. I'm glad
    parents today only have to gamble a buck -- which with inflation is
    really only like $0.60 in 1991 dollars!

  • Youmadbr0

    I still don't understand why people would post non-sense comments that compare controllers with the IOS devices that are without controllers, you can't put it together mate: for me I think it is totally fine to play without any buttons, virtual controls on the iphone/ipod works fine for me; controller is a totally new experience which I am also comfortable with. Games on IOS devices are generally getting better and better, and I am totally satisfied with this new gaming platform. If you are totally into controllers then just stick with it, do not make comments like "games without controllers suck!" or some shit like that.

    • Ecco6t9

      It depends, id Software ported their classics with perfect touch controls.

      Sega on the other hand dragged and dropped their Genesis games and called it a day.

      • Youmadbr0

        Yeah I agree some controls are really awful on the ios devices depending on the games, but we need to seperate virtual controls from controllers, for those who don't like it well then go back and play xbox/ps3/wii/3ds, etc.

      • Anonymous

        I really disagree with you there. They're playable on a touch screen, but they're not fun to play on a touch screen. Playing the iOS version of Doom is basically functional, nothing more. Playing the XBLA version is a joy; the game just adapts perfectly to thumsticks. The basic moment to moment act of moving and turning is fun. In the iOS version, moving and turning is merely workable, not enjoyable. It functions, and that's all I can say in favor of it.

        On the Playstation Vita, Id could port all their old first person shooters with even better controls: aside from dual analog controls the back touchpad could be used for mouselook. I'm through rationalizing the playability of games with direct control on iOS. Merely functional is not enough; a game should be enjoyable to control.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_PJGSUJI2557XP65V3VLFNUPGOY Anthony Omari

      I think what everybody is saying about those iOS based games is that in order to get that deep experience of video games wih controllers, the actual devices would have to improve their interfaces. In order to do that, manufacturers would have invest significantly in the hardware, in turn raising the price for them and the consumer. All this would contradict he very reason people turn to these iOS games - affordability and accessibility. For the past 30 years the video games industry has only faced extinction because of their own practices. I reckon it still has its fate in it's own hands.

  • Capone

    The headline of this article made me laugh. Isn't it obvious that in the foreseeale future there will be no Nintendo games on non-Nintendo platforms?!
    Come on, Nintendo may be an ultraconservative company that truly believes it will be enough to create killer games to drive their own hardware. That was true until now, but this obviously isn't enough anymore in times of iOS and Android.
    But Nintendo is also a company that permanently thinks about which hardware is best for realizing their game ideas. They thought about 3D ten years ago when planning the GameCube. And -until hell freezes over- Nintendo always will try to create own hardware, "boxes that enable you to play Mario and Link", if you want.
    The video game industry is really big these days, and Nintendo always was a big player in this industry. But they have to learn that they can't control anything and anyone like they did in the past, as companies like Apple stole huge parts of the market without Nintendo even knowing what's going on.
    Now it's Nintendos turn, and this company was always best with it's back on the wall.

    When it comes to me: my latest Nintendo handheld was the GameBoy, but with the latest cut in price I may be considering the 3DS, too. It surely can't compete with my iPod Touch, but I love Nintendo games. And when Mario Kart 7 arrives, I probably can't resist to buy a 3DS. Maybe I'll pick up some DS games (like the Phoenix Wright series) then, because the 3DS lineup is rather horrible and expensive.

    But Nintendo earned so much cash with its Wii console that I really don't see any need for them to release their games on non-Nintendo platforms.

  • backtothis

    After reading all these articles, I'm really wondering why I bought the 3DS as my first Nintendo handheld since the Gameboy Color. I bought it to play first party titles like Pokemon, Mario, and Zelda honestly, but it really doesn't feel like it's worth it anymore. I've barely put in 25 hours total since I got it in May. Now that I think about it, it feels like nonsense since I'm buying games like Dead Space for $6.99 on launch day and for $0.99 just a few months later for the iOS. I've long since abandoned my PSP, the only game I liked being Crisis Core, but now that I'm juggling the 3DS with the iOS, there's still no comparison. I use my iPod at school, when I'm waiting in line, when I'm on the toilet, when I'm on a roadtrip, when I'm at work, and when I'm home in my chair in front of my MacBook. My 3DS...I didn't even bother bringing it with me during my trips this summer, and I sure as hell don't bring it to work. I've never been a fan of Microsoft gaming, but it would have been a much better idea to have gotten a XBOX 360 for the same price and games for only slightly more expensive but echelons better. I've spent $500 or more on the 3DS and games since late May and about $100 on the AppStore since then. Sadly to say, I've gotten more enjoyment out of one week's worth of the iOS than the few months I've had the 3DS and all of its latest releases that I wanted + Pokemon. Hell, I use the iPod more in a week than I've used my 3DS in over two months. I just bought Dead or Alive for $40 two days ago and haven't even opened the box yet. I don't know. It just doesn't make sense to me to be playing two portable devices at one time. I mean I have 200 paid games on my backlog on the iOS, and now I have 4 games on my backlog for the 3DS. They're just..there.Sorry for the wall of text, but yeah. Opinions and advice? I'm thinking about trading my 3DS and all of my games in for a XBOX and some games, but I highly doubt I'll have access to a TV in my college dorm next semester. Not sure what the point of having hundreds of dollars in Gamestop credit would be otherwise though. Maybe I should buy a few hundred dollars worth of iTunes giftcards with that money instead from Gamestop? Not up for selling anything on eBay, and I've never seen a pawn shop around here before to trade this stuff in for cash. So yeah, comments?

  • Anonymous

    Time to release the NintenPhone! :-)

  • http://twitter.com/Davidprimer3 Davidprimer

    People shouldn't be comparing a 3DS to an iOS device imo, but everyone does compare them and I understand that but it's just not like it should be.

    I see iOS devices as gaming platforms too & I love playing games on them, iOS proved they can do it right, but it doesn't feel like a real console or handheld.

    & do we want consoles dead?
    If you're a REAL gamer, you won't buy iOS for playing games. People are just brainwashed by the pricing that iOS did. All games for like between 0.99 & 6 dollars.

    Do you think Zelda: Ocarina of Time 3D is worth less than 40$? I don't think so.

    Nintendo has a very strong software line-up coming in the next months, let's see what happens by the beginning of next year...

    • http://twitter.com/The_Unflattered Gee Lampa

      Yes. Yes I do think a port of a 15+ year-old console tiltle is worth less than $40. And I'm right, too.

      FFT will be on the iPhone by next week, and you can BET that it isn't gonna be $40.

      "Real gamer", huh? All it takes to be a real gamer is two things. A) money, and B) games. I find the phrase "Real Gamer" laughable, because I've owned almost every major console since the 2600, and now I'm an adult with a job, a wife and a lot of other interests. I'm still sweating the release date for Deus Ex and Skyrim, but when it comes to handhelds, I know damn well that my iPhone has the muscle to hand me a legion of quality titles.

      Games that benefit from physical button / D-Pad setups are usually a chore to play on ANY portable. FPS are a bitch to play, even on the PSP.

      I have Ascendancy, Palm Heroes, Avadon, Battle For Wesnoth, Highborn and Neuroshima Hex in my pocket, dawg!! What's in yours?

      On the surface, I'd say Ascendancy ALONE makes me a "real" gamer.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000466725810 Dan Short

        By your logic, one could argue that bluray releases of old movies should release for bargain bin prices. I am happy to pay 20-30 dollars for a Disney classic on Blu-Ray because of the incredible remastering/extra features put into the new release. Zelda is the same way; It's a classic game that's been lovingly recreated, with new features and remastered graphics in a package that's priced the same as the rest of the 3ds library. I have no problem paying modern prices for a modernized classic.

        It's my opinion that the art put out by Nintendo is well worth its price. In fact, I'd even buy a system for a new core Mario title. To me, that experience is worth the 210 dollars it would take to buy a 3ds and Super Mario 3d Land when it launches this November. Nintendo creates experiences that speak to people all over the world. They've done it for decades, and they'll continue doing it for decades more.

        Final Fantasy Tactics is another awesome experience, and if Square Enix put the same amount of time and effort to modernize it that was put into Zelda, I'd gladly pay 40 dollars for it. Hell, I did do that on PSP. And we have iOS "gamers" constantly bitching and moaning about the premium pricing Square puts its iOS games out for. If they put 99 cents worth of effort into their titles then they wouldn't have the same effect.

        I have not played a title on iOS that can compare to any of the console/handheld games I consider to be classics. To say that 40 dollar games have no place because 99 cent games are becoming popular is tantamount to suggesting that no one should sell fine art or art prints because you could just draw something yourself or print something on the computer. That's just crazy.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        Modernizing a classic is not up-ressing textures, applying a few filters to kill the jaggies, and adding in a new dungeon or boss.  Chrono Trigger retailed at $60-80 when it first came out.  Its "modernized" port for the DS was released at half that cost because it really only had those extra dungeons tacked on.  If it had added nothing, I would have been hesitant to pay $30.  In my opinion, $15-20 is a good price for a 1:1 port of a last decade AAA game.  And in case you haven't noticed, most older films DO retail at a lower price when they're re-released on Bluray. 

        Disney is, unfortunately, an anomaly who can get away with their crazy bundle packs because so many children have been invested in their films across the years.  As someone said in another forum I frequent, you can't really justify explaining to a 4 year old why they can't play Lion King in the back seat of the car just because you only have the blu-ray version.  Thus, the higher priced combo packs continue to sell.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000466725810 Dan Short

        Chrono Trigger DS retailed for 40 dollars, the same as most Square Enix DS titles came out at. It didn't come out at 60 to 80 dollars because no DS game costs that much. The additions that Square Enix made to the game also can't compare to what Grezzo has done with Zelda here.

        Ocarina 3D isn't a 1:1 port; it has the unlockable master quest, a boss rush mode, and it incorporates touch screen and motion controls. The touch screen is useful, the motion controls not so much. The awesome thing is that the game looks amazing, with or without 3d. They didn't just up the resolution, they actually redid many of the models and textures. They looked at the concept art and source materials and made the game look great. I just got it two days ago, and I've really been impressed with it.

        For 1:1 "ports", Nintendo has the virtual console. They just emulate the old roms, and they don't charge full retail prices for those games. I think they're all below ten dollars. Zelda 3d doesn't fall into this category.

        A notable rip-off would be Mario All-Stars 25th Anniversary Collection. It was pretty much just a rom of Mario All-Stars from the SNES, and they charged 30 dollars for it.

        What I'm trying to get at with the Blu-Ray thing is that "classic" movies, when remastered and given a special edition, don't come out at bargain bin prices. People understand this because it's reasonable to charge the standard price when that much work has been put in. The recent Wizard of Oz re-release is a good example.

        It's probably not that obvious how well done the new Zelda remake is. It's awesome. I'd have bought it anyway, because I'm a huge fan, but it really is worth the price.

        Also, I want to make it clear that I love my iPhone. I buy games for it all the time. But I think I value the gaming experience I've had with my DS/DS Lite/DSi a lot more, and I'm perfectly happy to have paid 30-40 dollars for all the wonderful games I've played on that system. If developers can truly find a way to put all the depth you would find in a game like Dragon Quest IX (the music, dialogue, and sheer amount of quality gameplay in that game is insane) into a 1-10 dollar game, and that would be a viable price point for them, then I'd be all for it. I just haven't seen a game like that yet on iOS that isn't a port. The closest thing I've found is Infinity Blade. Cool lore, decent gameplay, great graphics, but no story :(. Any game suggestions?

        But if all of the "console-type" games on iOS are ports, how has the app store model proven itself to be a viable platform for these types of games?

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        You may be right about the DS re-release retailing at $40 on launch.  It has been a while since I purchased it.  However, the lowest I ever saw the original Chrono Trigger for the SNES was $60, and that was used years after the game was released.  I imagine it was probably $80 like many high profile cartridge games in those days.  And yet it did not retail for $60 when it was re-released on the DS.  If it had, I would absolutely not have purchased it.  It simply did not have enough features added in the extra dungeon, hidden boss, and monster arena.  It was an extremely competent game though, and at this point it has dropped to $20 which I would consider a perfect price point for a good port with a few bonuses tacked on.

        I'm sorry, but I just don't see the Zelda port as being any different.  From the footage I've seen and feature list you just mentioned, it's no better than the remake of Chrono Trigger, and I consider Chrono Trigger to be a superior game in terms of detail and quality to begin with.  The textures look like they were up-ressed and filtered with new 3D models at the higher resolution, but they were not detailed to begin with.  I cannot see anything but a cash in game, and I wouldn't pay $40 for it after getting it as a free pack-in with another game on the GameCube (which had the master quest included), and then being able to purchase it on the Wii virtual console as well.  There's a point where you shouldn't charge full price for a rehash of a game, and Nintendo is well past it.  And the 3D is a non-feature as long as that battery only lasts 3-4 hours with it on.  That is a horrendous battery life for what was previously a $250 system.

        And to answer your final question, there are plenty of console-type games on iOS.  They just aren't being put out by EA and Activision (although EA did release Dead Space).  Real Racing 2 is absolutely a console quality game, going so far as to output to a TV in 1080p if you have the connectors to do so.  Many of the RPGs are full console length, even if they aren't the 3D extravaganzas that people seem all too fixated on these days.  Space Miner ate up hours of my time, and mixed RPG and space shooting elements wonderfully.  It would easily be at home on XBox Live Arcade, although its particular genre crossing may be a harder sell as a disc.  There are so many more that don't get the credit they deserve just because they're a downloadable rather than on a little piece of plastic.  And that will only increase as the big players turn their heads and notice the success of the iPad and Touch lines more and more.

  • Anonymous

    It might help if there was a Nintendo phone, do it properly taking onboard what works well for Apple and improving on it. The alternative is having Apple take more market share.

    I use to be against convergence devices, then I got bored having a phone, iPod and a 3DS in my pocket. Now I just have the iPhone in my pocket with 24/7 access to music and gaming software. 

    I also have an iPad at home.

    I speak as an old timey Nintendo fan who wants Nintendo to stay great.

  • Mike Moore

    Well I ended up buying a 3DS about 2 months ago as it was on sale for about 35% off after playing Pilot Wings in the shop on it (loved Pilot Wings on the SNES and N64).  In that time I’ve bought about another 5 games (I always go mad when I buy a new console).  I didn’t pay more then £20 for any of the games except for Zelda which to be honest I don’t think is too bad as there’s a chain of middle men getting their cut in physical software sale instead of just Apple taking their 33%

    My personal verdict of the 3DS is that it’s ok, it’s nothing special and the 3D effect is really annoying as you don’t have to move your head that much to screw the effect up and I end up playing most of the games with the 3D turned off, which basically means that it does’t do anything that my iPhone / iPad / iPod can’t do and I wouldn’t feel as easy pulling a 3DS out on the train as I would my iPhone.  The control system is neither here or there for me as the stick on joypads for the iPad work a treat for me to be honest.

    It really comes down to the games and what you want from the games and Nintendo do have an amazing catalog of games (Mario, Zelda, Metriod, Donkey Kong and so on), but saying that I’m also getting old (almost 40) and I really don’t have the 20+ hours needed to complete Zelda again even thou it is an amazing game and that’s why the cheap, quick little iOS games work better for me.

    I must spend £40+ a month on iOS games every month and I really don’t mind that as I get to try lots of different games and the standard quality of games now is getting a lot higher then it was even a year ago.

    I do think Nintendo have a really strong battle to fight against Apple and the only thing they have is the (great) catalog of Nintendo games, but they can only release 3-5 titles a year and with more publishers going over to iOS with good quality games at a lot less I really don’t think it looks good for them.

    I wouldn’t like to see Nintendo go the same way as Sega, but they need something special to get out of the hole they are digging themselves.

  • http://twitter.com/marcomaz Marco Mazzoli

    Article was spot on I think. It's both strange and sad to see Nintendo looking genuinely worried and lacking in the vision that has kept them on top for so long.

    I bought a 3DS just for Ocarina of time, and I really enjoyed playing it, but I can't see myself using it that much in the future, just because of the complete software drought, and the delivery system which simply makes the experience feel like I'm playing a retro console.

    I so wanted the 3DS to be device where like iOS, you could *only* purchase games through the online store, and also like iOS, Nintendo really opened themselves up to third party developers. I really feel that had they done that they could have not only competed against the AppStore, but also created a fresh new feel and direction for their company. I think people would have really responded to seeing a gaming giant like Nintendo embrace this new world proactively, instead of reluctantly. 

    It seems to me that if they're not careful, their desire to hold onto the business model that they obviously feel is an inseparable part of their company identity could well result in their slow demise. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/OoOoOomonkey John Usher

    Well IMO I have a ds lite and psp but after tasting the app store goodness I would never buy another game for another handheld. The app store has so many games and there all so cheap that it makes no sense to pay £20-£30 for a game when I could have 30 games for that price.

  • Vimy

    i think its simple economics for Nintendo. they are in the same position apple was in 1996, they have tons of money in the bank, a few software advantages and no clients.

    apple got out of this hell by finding new types of devices, (Imac) etc to attract casual computer users and held titlly to the software, (Final Cut Pro) which professionals preferred. this kept them in business and let them grow modestly until the IOS came and exploded there business models.

    It may be true that Nintendo is having trouble with there new devices but they have a ton of money and can wait things out a bit. presently they are missing a killer app for there handheld and this is largely because of the decision to go 3D. no one really knows how to take advantage of this yet with any success and so everyone is a little apprehensive about it.Hopefully for Nintendo  however, some game will come out that will become a must have and the system will sell. Personalty I think the small screen and gimmiky 3d were pour decisions but thats besides the point.

    i think its premature for Nintendo to openly release there IP's. Seta did it only when the realized that there consol market was dead and they had no choice but to move to software only or cease to exist., Nintendo is still, primarily , a console building company and the many past success stories in this field should not be overlooked.

    Giving there IP's to other systems would endanger there consol market. imagine playing mario on xbox 360, with better graphics etc than possible on the wii. They need to keep there money makers at home and force there fan boys to buy Nintendo sytems. its a simple business decision.

  • Sajak

    That would be a problem, but even the best iOS game doesn't even come close to being as good as a second-rate DS game.  iOS games are not in the same league as dedicated gaming system games are.  Don't compare them. 

    And the 3DS isn't selling well because it doesn't have any good games.  The two best games are the system are a port of a year old game that is better on other consoles and a remake (not a port as the article misnames it) of a 13 year-old game.  3DS sales in Japan jumped once Star Fox released there a couple weeks ago, and that isn't even a system seller.  People are just waiting for games to be released, and the pricing wasn't helping anything.

    • Vimy

      there are plenty of hardcore games on IOS.

      some like GTA China Town Wars are on all handhelds with the IOS one being the highest rated.
      there are tons of advanced shooters, Nova series, COD Battlefield etc
      there are tons of racers, Need for speed, or RR, RR series especially is the best on any handheld period
      RPG's, like the Quest Gold for the hardcore 
      there are even MMO's

      and all that at 25% the cost, (or less)

      this is a serious gaming device for a handheld and that is why it owns the market place.

      • Sajak

        They're traditional games, sure, but they all suffer from major control issues that don't exist on traditional gaming systems, and the experiences are severely hampered by that.  Until the iOS gets built-in buttons and joysticks, it will always be a watered down gaming experience.  Having optional add-ons (like the ones that exist now) only help with the games that support them, and I know of very few. 

        And the cost is as is for a reason:  You get what you pay for.  I've tried playing many traditional games on my iTouch (Aralon, GTA, various RPGs like Ash or Zenonia, different racing games, Eliminate, etc.) and they were all just not as enjoyable as they would be on a traditional gaming system.  Even games like Swords & Soldiers (a favorite of mine on Wiiware) just isn't as good because of the controls.

        iOS has delivered on bringing me some great gaming experiences, but they've all been shallow games like Bumpy Road, Spike Dislike, Peggle, Dungeon Raid, or Orbital.  I play games on my iTouch just about everyday, but the only ones that I actually enjoy are the more casual games, because they aren't tedious to play. 

      • Vimy

        they both have there roles. 
        I have never been a Nintendo fan boy, I just dont like Mario, I would kick his ass if I could.

        my personal issues with reality aside however, I think apple has revolutionized the hand held world, while Nintendo has fumbled the ball with there latest technology.

        the controls give Sony and Nintendo an advantage, but the universality of the app store, the price point and just the hardware design of apple's devices are the reason for there success.
        There hardware concepts are limited by conservative thinking, (there ideas of handheld have roots going back to the 70's with only memory horsepower being the biggest change) Gimmicks such as 3d, are ignored by developers who don't even know what to do with it.

        to be honest, the only real competition apple will have over the next few years will come from android and possibly windows 7 phone. the previous kings of the hill need to re-imagine there devices. the lack of buzz or for that matter software is an indictment of there technologies failure and there marketing. no one is excited to make a 3DS game, (not even Nintendo according to the article and lack of titles)

      • Stevenmilligan

        There, their, they're...

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Frédéric-Lormois/100000030609443 Frédéric Lormois

        @Sajak:"Even games like Swords & Soldiers (a favorite of mine on Wiiware) just isn't as good because of the controls. "
        Troll.
        Swords and Soldiers is just perfect for the iOS controls...
        So you are juste à troll here.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000466725810 Dan Short

        Swords and Soldiers is on iOS? Seriously? Instant buy. I love that game.

      • Sajak

        Scrolling isn't as good because there aren't any buttons to allow to train units while you scroll and selecting the right enemy or ally to cast a spell is near impossible once you have anything around it.  If you call someone who wants precision, then that's your problem. 

    • http://twitter.com/The_Unflattered Gee Lampa

      "...but even the best iOS game doesn't even come close to being as good as a second-rate DS game.  iOS games are not in the same league as dedicated gaming system games are.  Don't compare them."

      This has to be the most inaccurate thing I've ever read. I don't even think you believe, deep down, what you've written. You're so preoccupied with the notion of dedicated device superiority, you've become slightly demented. There are a zillion half-baked shovelware titles for the DS, and each one coming in at a minimum $20 price point. The only difference between the platforms is that the developers for iOS price that crap where it belongs on the iPhone; the $.99 bin.
      Neroshima Hex is a strategy title that is exclusive to iOS, and it beats 90% of stategy titles on the DS platform. Ascendancy is an old PC port that I used to pray I'd see on a handheld. It took the flexible development and submission tools for iOS to make that happen. Port or no port, the only thing that matters is which system sees the most compelling content. I already know the answer to that. Every day some awesome classic or new surprise is making it's way to the iPhone. It reminds me of what made PC gaming so much more interesting than console gaming, back in the day; variety. I'm playing Sid Meyers' "Pirates" on the iPad, as of last week. I'm playing Heroes Of Might and Magic. THAT'S gaming.

      Developers for DS that have to concern themselves with packaging, manufacturing costs, inventory and freight can't afford to take chances, and need to hit you w/ a $20-30 price tag, just to show a profit. They only publish "bankable" titles for the DS. Dora, Spongebob, Tinkerbell, Zhu Zhu Pets, Bakugan and awful FPS's that look like butt, and play even worse.

      • Sajak

        The amount of bad games on a system is irrelevant.  Most people look at the good games on a system to decide if it's good or not. 

        That's entirely your opinion.  I could just as easily say that Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon, Final Fantast Tactics Advanced 2, and Age of Mythologies are better than any strategy game on iOS (which they are for many reasons), but there's no way to actually declare one as officially better than the other. 

        Developers for the iOS have to find a way to make their game known to even get a sale.  Even dedicated App Store websites (like this one) can only cover so many of the games that are being released, and basically 99% of them go unannounced or unnoticed because of how flooded the App Store is.  There are problems with both types of development.  The App Store certainly has many advantages, but the only way somebody is making a profit is if the game gets featured somewhere on the App Store. 

        I don't see the relevance of the last sentence.  Those aren't the games people buy the system for (and that shows if you look at any of those game's sales), and I don't think the DS even has 8 FPS...  Nice try though. 

  • Jerry

    I carry my iphone in my front left pocket and my dsi (r4i card) in my front right pocket. I have access to to 700+ games 24/7, I love apple and nintendo.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_QCP4WHWLUQHFIOP66SLEA7E5CA Hampus

      But I suppose you don't care much for the people developing the games? With a r4i card I get this feeling you haven't bought all those 700+ games.

      • Jerry

        I do care for them. I wish those corporations the best.

  • curtisrshideler

    I began gaming with an Atari and grew to love gaming once I got an NES and Gameboy. So, Nintendo has really been at the heart of my gaming since I was 8 or 9 years old. BUT, after I got rid of my Gamecube and original DS, I've never really gone back to Nintendo. I love the Mario games, Zelda games, and Metroid games, but getting a console just to play those over-priced titles is not worth it to me.

    Once I got an iPhone and delved deep into the App Store, I realized that I could play games that were just as engaging and beautiful as those at a fraction of the cost. And you're right. I can download any of them in seconds! So, if I got the craving to play NOVA 2 after beating NOVA, I don't have to save up $40 and find a store to buy it at... I can just hit the download button and be knee deep in FPS brilliance in a matter of a minute.

    And now that I can relive my Sonic memories and Final Fantasy memories, there is no hope that I'll ever go back to a DS. So, unfortunately for Nintendo, they won't see my money ever again unless they decide to step into the 21st century and port some games to the App Store for a reasonable price! And hopefully, they will.

    • Anonymous

      I think you're rationalizing NOVA as being good because it's cheap and your iPhone is popular. All the game does is look like Halo; it contains some textures and models that look like they where ripped out of a Halo game. It doesn't actually have any of the qualities that make Halo special. If the game wasn't trying to look exactly like a popular game, then I could enjoy it. It's clone status just reminds me of the game it's copying. It's more or less one of those Valuesoft knockoff games from the early 2000s.

      If your criterion for a good game is "it has some models, textures and a few light sources, looks similar to a popular franchise, and is roughly playable and functional" then I guess NOVA is good. I say you can't put a price on identity and character though.

  • NoMercy

    I don't know if i should do this , but i would like to share this interesting point of view that i read on kotaku wich i think completely nailed it
    Link :http://kotaku.com/5825872/nintendo-president-takes-blame-for-3ds-getting-50-percent-pay-cut

    devilgunman "Digital camera market is facing the same fate as
    gaming market. Because at its core, it's composed of the two sides just
    like gaming: hardcore and casual. The point-and shoot camera is dying
    right now because casual photographers have turned their back on it and
    use phone camera exclusively. On the other hand DSLR market for
    hardcore photographers is more solid than ever because the technology
    to make DSLR becomes cheaper and that make DSLR a lot more affordable
    than before. If you apply the example from digital camera market to
    gaming, you will see what is truly going on with Nintendo. Their casual
    market is disappearing and popping on iPhone & Android side and
    they have no hardcore market to turn into. On the other hand, Sony is
    doing what they've been doing; serving their hardcore market with a
    nice hardware and game lineup. At the end of the day, I think Sony will
    survive but Nintendo will become the new Sega. (Edit comment)"

    • Zoet

      That is a brilliant analogy! but I do hope it works out for gaming that a profitable 'hardcore' market still exists, and we aren't left with only 'SomethingVille'. 

  • Rudi

    Nintendo could earn millions, if they release older games like Super Mario World for IOS.
    They could release newer games exclusively for their own cosoles, but earn lots of money with the older ones on IOS. Instead they force us to jailbreak our devices and play the games for free.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_QCP4WHWLUQHFIOP66SLEA7E5CA Hampus

      Indeed, just imagine if they ported over Super Mario World, Super Mario Allstarts and Mario Kart 64, the would all earn them a lot of money, specially Mario Kart because there simply isnt anyone who can compete with it.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      And they could pull a Microsoft... by practicing with a competitors superior product, they could prep their own iPod touch competitor, etc. How about a Nintendo Android phone? :P

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_QCP4WHWLUQHFIOP66SLEA7E5CA Hampus

    Fine with me, I mean, I'd gladly pay 10 bucks for Mario Kart or Mario Bros on my iPhone and iPad (and I usually won't spend that much on one single app) but I won't have a separate portable gaming device again, I sold my DS Lite just this week, hasn't used it for about two years my iPod touch and later iPhone took it's place.

  • JoelCairo

    Apple will be the cause of the second video game crash, mark my words. If you look at the first video game crash of the 80's and compare it to what Apple is doing right now with the App store you can see history repeating itself. Atari flooded the market with cheap half baked, button mashing clones to the point where the average consumer just lost interest in the whole hobby and walked away. Take a good hard look at the app store and count how many cheap Angry Birds, Cut the Rope or Fruit Ninja clones there are in the store....clones of games that weren't even that great to begin with I might add.
    Any one who compares the game experience of a five minute time waster liker Angry Birds to the depth and breadth of a game like Metroid Prime, Ico or even Halo is clearly not an avid gamer. And while the argument can be made that IOS has it's fair share of triple AAA titles, most are pale imitations of their console brethren that struggle to replicate the precision control offered in a dedicated handheld. Video Games saw a resurgence because companies like Sony and Microsoft sank money and development into making games epic experiences, it was an investment that drove the market forward and took gaming past the movie industry in revenue. When Apple started out with the app store they didn't have an established reputation in gaming so they courted the garage developers to fill out their store and offer game for dirt cheap...the problem is that mentality has stuck and Apple has had a hard time shaking that rep off and they are  dragging the die hard gamers down with them...the Wii which targeted the casual gamer didn't help the situation either and took the reputation of Nintendo into the same depths as the iPhone. The current situation of the gaming market combined with the declining economy will most likely see the second crash of the gaming industry with Nintendo being the first victim.

    • Anonymous

      Well, Apple wouldn't cause the crash, its people buying too many shitty iOS games (and making too many shitty clones), that would cause a crash. It's also all the people getting caught up into this irrational "Apple is God" fanboyism that's overtaking the world, ignoring how mediocre their products are becoming next to the competition.

      Frankly I wish the market would crash though. I have essentially been in a nearly non existent gaming niche for 5 years now. Everything I like is considered "outdated" or not "mainstream enough." I don't like either of these hardcore and casual camps and I wouldn't mind if the entire market burnt to the ground. At least then people with actual ideas might rise from the ashes and re-build the way Nintendo did in the 80s.

    • Decoy Octopus

      I agree with everything you said except I don't think a crash will hurt Nintendo as much as it will Apple

      • Pmatch

        How the hell would it hurt Apple more than Nintendo? Games on the itunes store are a tiny fraction of Apple's income and people buy iphones and ipads and ipod touches for hundreds of uses beyond games (if they even buy them for games at all.) 

  • backtothis

    I don't understand why people not into iOS gaming post on TouchArcade. I really don't. You MUST have something better to do.

    • JoelCairo

      I do play iOS games, as a real gamer I own any and all devices that allow me to play games including an ipod 4th gen. But good games on iOS are far and few between. Sword & Sworcery Ep was fantastic as was Edge and Bumpy Road but as an avid gamer I can see the harm most of these casual apps are having on the game market...just as I knew Wii was harmful to the dedicated console market. The Wii was called out as fad by die hard gamers and look where the Wii is just 4 short years later. iOS gaming is not helping to improve the situation either.  Game developers (like EA) will always look for the easiest and cheapest way to sell games and they will jump all over iOS development because they can pay a small team of three or four developers to crank out four or five mediocre mini games and still turn a tidy profit with little investment. But that can't last forever and the market  will implode just as Wii's casual gaming collapsed in on Nintendo. 

      But no one here is into iOS gaming really are they?...I mean aside from Sword & Sworcery and a few other titles what is there really to get "into". Fruit Ninja is a distraction at best and Angry Birds is the antithesis of gaming. Nearly everything else is about leader boards and high scores with little to no depth. Even Infinity Blade was a stripped down action game that couldn't muster more then a boiled down hack and slash mechanic.

       Young kids buy into because they have limited attention spans and even less disposable cash. Older adults buy into because they have limited time and patience. I equate the iOS gamer to that friend who believes video gaming started and ended with Pac Man. The one who is always reminiscing about how great and challenging the old arcade games like Centipede were compared to the current market without ever having picked up a PS3 or Xbox 360 controller. Or even the girlfriend who would only play Tetris. I know that iOS gaming is casual at best because my wife, an admitted hater of video games, will play Fruit Ninja for 10 minutes or so and smile and then move on but refuses to play a game like Professor Layton for more then 3 seconds.

      Apple doesn't care about video games. They spend no money on in house development or creating first party titles. They invest no money into R&D for in game engines. They have no first party developers. Their consoles of choice are not even really consoles they are phones and media players. Steve Job's only goal is to amass as much content as he can onto iTunes and find a way to shovel into your device. If developers and gamers were smart and wanted to save the future of their industry, and their jobs in the process, they would turn away from the iPhone, iPad and iPod development and focus on the consoles. Apple is not their partner or friend...it's an enemy you keep close and keep satiated with your bottom barrel IPs and save your top tier stuff for the console developers who feed a portion of the profits back into the industry to keep it moving forward.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        Apple should not be concerned about creating content for their device beyond what comes stock with the OS.  They should be storefront for the hardware they sell and leave it at that.  That's how the whole issue with them trying to take 30% of in-app purchases from stores they aren't maintaining came up.  They got involved in selling their own content and then made changes to their policies that benefit only themselves.  It's a slippery slope and I don't want to see it happen in the games section like it did with the e-books.

        And I'm not sure where you're going with damning pick up and play style games like Fruit Ninja, or classics like Tetris.  There's absolutely nothing wrong with "one more round" style games, which have been a staple of the industry from the very beginning.  It's the tuning and polish of those titles that should be important.  If someone makes an amazing score attack game, it has every right to exist, and is as important to certain paying customers as Call of Duty is to the shooter crazed crowd that currently dominate the console space.  I would be careful before attacking a genre, because your favorite could be the next to become overpopulated and crash on itself a few years down the line too.

      • JoelCairo

        If Apple has no vested interested in the gaming market then they can abandoned it at the drop of a hat. There is no risk involved and that's how Apple likes it. And there's a huge difference between making and developing games and trying to own a percentage of the take of those that actually create them. Your first paragraph does not address the concerns I raised about Apple sinking R&D back into the industry...they are just leeching off of it and you pretty much confirmed that with your "30% of in-app purchases" comment.

        Pick up and play style games are what killed the industry in the first place. This is why I damn them. People complain all the time that movies are being dumbed down to appeal to lowest common denominator and most of us over the age of twenty would agree to that assessment. So why is pick up and play style gaming any different. It also appeals to the lowest common denominator. While appealing to the casual masses may give you big profitability over a short time line it cannot be sustained as your audience is not dedicated nor loyal to the market you are trying to sustain. This is why Nintendo is now struggling with a 50% drop in Wii sales, the casual gamer got it's fill of Wii sports, Wii Sports Resort 2 and Wii Fit and then moved on leaving the console unplayed and with third party developers unable to manage any kind of profit with their dedicated IPs. But Wii's early success and then rapid decline should stand as a model to console manufacturers and developers to avoid. The fact that the casual market has a short life span has been proven time and time again and the app store is on track to repeat the same history that plague Atari and Intellivsion in the early 80's. What is sad is that it is taking hardcore games with it (just look at Xbox 360's line up for 2011 and you will see that even their major IPs like Fable are being tainted with Kinect support and marketed to the casual gamer).

        Pick up and play gaming had it's place in the halcyon days of the arcades and arrival of the home console but the market has evolved since then and you only evolve by developing gradually from a simple to more complex form. Without evolution your market stagnates and iOS gaming is more de-evolution then evolution.

        p.p1 {margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 16.0px Baskerville}

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        Apple isn't the one making these games. All does it sit back and let the 'lisence fees' pour in (30% of sales)... kinda like what Nintendo used to do with the NES and SNES.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        Apple has never had a vested interest in the games market, but I maintain that they should be a storefront and nothing else in the interest of staying objective in terms of what is accepted to the app store.  And the 30% of game sales is to cover their hosting costs, delivery, and app update costs.  What I take issue with is their demand for 30% of sales in apps that are paying for their own subscription service or item sales hosting.  Amazon should not have to give up all their profit on e-books they are hosting, advertising, and delivering via their own servers.  Apple's iBooks store is a conflict of interest that I wish to avoid in other areas of the store.

        As for the topic of games, you completely ignored everything I said.  I said that QUALITY games should exist in all forms and genres regardless of type.  There are as many quality pick up and play games as there are quality shooters or RPGs for those interested in them.  It's when the sub-par sequels and garbage imitators flood the market to the point that only they remain that there is the danger of a crash.  Atari flooded the market with junk that wasn't worth playing, and it paid the price.  The same with the current plummet of the Wii.  Its software was simply not strong enough to hold the system afloat.  The app store has on the contrary seen an increase in talented programmers introducing new concepts and highly polished work over the last few years.  There is no Nintendo dropping a good game here and there in a bucket of slop on the app store.  It's a continuous stream of games of varying quality, some better than others obviously.  But there is a steady supply of strong titles being released, even if they are not the type you decide to recognize as such.  If you disagree, that is your prerogative, but I would suggest you broaden your horizons instead of damning what others may find entertaining. 

        As a final example for you, I quite enjoyed the Deep Dive pinball game despite it being nothing but a high score game.  All pinball games are simply high score contests after all.  I played it for 15-20 minutes a day for several weeks whenever I was bored.  The other tables their company offer did not interest me as much, but the reviews suggest some people were thrilled with the Slayer table they released.  Do you think pinball, which had appeal for decades, should be erased as a concept because it has no story or end game to it?  Just because I do not appreciate something personally, it doesn't mean someone is wrong for having fun in their own way, in their favored style of game play.

      • JoelCairo

        I agree that the Wii plummeted because it's software was not strong enough to hold it afloat...but look at the App store and you will immediately notice it has at least three times the amount of shovelware that the Wii had. If quantity versus quality is what killed the Wii then the iOS app market has that problem in spades. 

        You say Atari flooded the market with Junk and I say the App store is doing the same thing. You love Deep Dive Pinball (I belive it's just Deep Pinball) a game you consider to be a quality title...well I just did a little experiment and typed pinball into the search engine on itunes and it came back with over 2 pages and more then 100 apps based on pinball... and you want to talk about flooding the market with junk? Your Deep Pinball didn't even register in the top five! It came in 7th behind five free games so if quality is your concern it certainly isn't Apple's who is just fine with burying quality titles in a sea of garbage. 

        Aside from Sword and Sworcery EP I would also beg to differ on the increase in quality software comment but I guess on that matter we will have to agree to disagree.But just to back my argument up take a look at the top paid apps list! It's practically the same list I saw over two months ago with Angry Birds and it's multitudes of offshoots taking up three spots and with Cut the Rope, Fruit Ninja and Tiny Wings making up the majority of the rest of the list. All of these games were released months and months ago, so if there is a steady stream of quality titles why aren't they replacing these aging apps on the list.

        I am not here to belittle your choices of games. I will be the first to admit I enjoy the occasional round of Tiny Wings or even Building that additional floor on Tiny Tower or getting a distance record on Canabalt. But as an avid gamer and owner of a PS3, Xbox 360, Wii, PSP, 3DS, Sony ARC and Ipod 4th gen and can also see where Apple is leading the market and it doesn't bode well for gamers like me. The real irony is that by owning an iPod I am one of Apple's enablers. Also I don't practice what I preach was is one of the signs of a video game addict. 

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        You are again correct, that particular app is called The Deep Pinball.  However, your search is a bit ill informed.  Among the top 10 searches for iPhone apps typing "pinball" as the search, four of the apps are from the company I was referring to that made The Deep.  Each of their tables are available separately plus the retina "HD" combo package has the first three plus the fourth table they released available as an in-app purchase.  Among the rest are Pinball Dreaming, which is an update of a classic set of tables originally on the Amiga, and Pinball Ride, which got good reviews as a table.  Admittedly, the other four items may be junk.  But then again, they may not be, and there are a few more quality titles further down the list because they're newer and have less overall purchases than the older titles.  You also have to take into account that many titles have a "lite" or "free" demo duplicate.  I don't like the flood either, but customers have made very clear they don't understand the in-app buying of full versions within the trial (see Gameloft's attempt with their Starcraft and Zelda clones).

        The issue with Atari and Wii is that they flooded the market with so much junk, and at such high prices (being cartridge and disc based, with retail distribution costs involved) that they were unable to survive.  Apple has a digital store.  They can afford to have a million apps on it.  Best Buy cannot even hold 200 games on its shelves at any given time.  So not only is the signal to noise ratio much more lenient, but there is always the opportunity for cross promotion of older titles when something new is released.  Now, I fully agree that the top 100 list is regularly gamed by a few dominant companies.  While Angry Birds and the like legitimately hold their spots out of sheer sales numbers, companies like EA and Gameloft flood the top 100 on a frequent basis with their $1 nearly catalog-wide sales.  But that doesn't keep new titles from showing up on the "What's Hot", "New and Noteworthy", or "What We're Playing" lists.  Assuming there is no backroom manipulation going on, you're only going to get on those lists if your title is new, recently popular, or Apple's people really like it.  They're a very good resource, alongside review sites like this one for finding great titles to play.  If the only list was the Top 100 and Top Grossing lists, I would agree with you, but that just isn't the case.

        Obviously, our views on what quality in games entail differ drastically, but I just have a hard time accepting blanket statements that only a handful of games measure up to the enjoyment I've had on a console, because in all honesty, this generation of console games have disappointed me greatly.  The move to 3D everything, with a layer of shooter dabbed on practically every genre imaginable has me not quite enjoying things as much as I used to.  There are very few risks taken anymore in the console market, and even the franchises I used to love are feeling stale lately (Final Fantasy XIII in particular has been a chore slowly working my way through).  I have hopes that a resurgence of creative thinking is coming on all sides, but in the meantime I derive a lot of joy from the gems I find on the app store.

  • HelperMonkey

    Nintendo had a lot of success with the Wii.  Less so thus far with 3DS.  But the surest way for them to destroy any success that either might have in the future would be to license their first-party game line-up.  It would end their presense in the hardware market.  Full stop.

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000466725810 Dan Short

    By the way, the fact that Zelda 3d wasn't developed in-house shouldn't take away from the game at all. The CEO of Grezzo, the developer who did the remake, is Koichi Ishii, the man behind the Mana series of games from Square. The fact that Nintendo entrusted them with Zelda--and they hit a home run--is very promising. Nintendo has done things like this before, notably with Retro Studios, an unproven studio at the time who absolutely killed it with their work on the Metroid Prime series.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      At least Metroid Prime was a new game............

  • Mike

    "Taking full responsibility for the 3DS, Nintendo president Satoru Iwata has taken a 50% pay cut with other executives taking similar 20-30% pay cuts." 
    Now that's class. It's a shame American businessmen don't behave that way.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      Well, most CEO's just get paid in stock...  This guy is driving Nintendo into the ground and you wanna pat him on the back? Okay

      • sniPyro

        How is he driving Nintendo into the ground? If he DID release Nintendo games on iOS that would truly drive Nintendo consoles into the ground, as the exclusivity of great first party Nintendo games would be lost. Soon 3DS will be no more and gradually the Wii U will lose it's appeal too. Nintendo is hardly going to make back all that profit just from the app store, especially the extremely low accepted pricing for games. He does have class, and I respect him greatly for cutting the pay of himself and executives first.

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        Time will tell if the Wii2 (whats it called again? wii-e? or something miiwii? Wii You.?) is a hit.. there's some iPad crossover there, which is interesting.. but come on.. a 3D handheld console that gives you a headache after 20mins of use? Come on... The financials speak for themselves

  • http://twitter.com/AnthonyM122 Anthony Mangiarciana

    Say what you want about Nintendo and the 3DS, but at 170 that is a great gaming machine. I love my Iphone too but I just thumbed through that freebie app website that this story points to and well there may be 4 games out of the hundreds that are listed that I would even consider downloading. And they are all free. By this time next year the 3DS will have a boat load of A titles. The Iphone will also have great titles albeit not nearly as in depth titles as you will get on a 3DS/PS Vita based machine. Nintendo does not need to put there games on the App store.  They will be fine in the long run as usual.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      You say that there will be a boatload of titles by next year, but the news lately has been a lot of companies pushing back of cancelling 3DS titles.  When you compare it to the first year of the DS, which also didn't have very many good titles, I would be a bit more worried about my investment in the system.  Certainly, there will be a half dozen first-party titles like Mario 3D, Mario Kart, and Kid Icarus, but after that, it's usually years before Nintendo puts out a new franchise title.  If the third-parties don't start turning the ship around now, it's going to be a long wait for the high cost/high risk titles to make it out.  By then Nintendo may have decided it's a Virtual Boy and bailed out of supporting the system.

      • JoelCairo

        And there's the rub! These hardcore titles weren't migrated to another system like iOS, they were cancelled flat out in favour of producing more casual games. In Capcom's case they cancelled one of their most cherished franchises, Mega Man, due to what? Fear the 3DS was failing? And what did they turn to instead? Street Fighter Volt? And this is the sad state of affairs that has been brought about by the casual market, developers killing off potentially deep and engaging titles in favour of a five minute distraction. The greed and short sightedness of the large development houses will be their own undoing.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        Actually they've focused on a large number of fighting game titles, including Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3, Street Fighter vs. Tekken, and a merchandise line of Street Fighter vs. Hello Kitty.  The last of which was probably the breaking point for a good number of Mega Man fans watching for Comicon news, even if it has no real bearing on the decisions to make a game.  The Devil May Cry remake is also on its way, although not receiving particularly high interest from the fans due to its radical redesign.  I feel like it's a bit of a fallacy to claim the effort is all moving to casual games when that's clearly not the case.  Sadly, they're moving to the genre they believe will make them the most money, which is Street Fighter and its ilk at the moment, be that on the PS3 or 360 or the iPhone.  I agree that it's short sighted, but it's in no way a shift to phone development as you're suggesting.  Volt was released well before any of the cancellations were made known.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      Don't look at the freebie games? Go check out the top grossing games on the iTunes store.. those are the best games. FFtactics coming in a few days.

  • Anonymous

    For casual users, Tiny Wings, Angry Birds, Farmville etc type crap is enough that they'll probably not bother going out and buying a 3DS. People already have iPhone and iPod Touch devices and this trend will continue for better or worse. 

    For serious gamers who want more, iOS delivers VERY WELL, however, if you want more serious pocket gaming, the PSP2 (I refuse to use the Vita name, what were Sony thinking?!) will give them Uncharted and some serious titles. I still doubt it will sell that well. 

    What both Sony and Nintendo need to do, is have their Flagship handheld consoles optionally 3G enabled, sold through phone shops, to appeal to those who game on their phone. 'Why get an iPhone and have average games if you can get the Nintendo DS Phone with Mario" etc. 

    As it is, people are forced to buy two devices, won't always have both with them when they go out, and the second non-phone device gets left at home, and it's the beginning of a vicious cycle.

    The only way they can break, or fend off, the trend of mobile phone gaming is to:
    1) offer great exclusive titles (easy for these guys)
    2) offer a device that prevents people also requiring another portable gaming device(phone)

    But Sony, and Nintendo to a much greater degree, will continue to bury their head in the sand until it's (hopefully almost) too late. 

    Fact.

    So, who's going to wager what will happen first: DSphone or Mario for iOS?

  • Anonymous

    Also, a list of 3DS games from here http://www.gamepro.com/article/features/218626/the-10-best-3ds-games-10/ is really quite telling:
    Best Game? Street Fighter IV 3D
    Then the port of the ancient Zelda.

    The fact that the second best game is a port of a 13 yo? title doesn't inspire confidence. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Gregory-Nicholas-Manno/89500832 Gregory Nicholas Manno

    History always repeats itself.  Sega got too involved in hardware and forgot that software is the most important part of the gaming universe as the software are the games.  Nintendo seems to be doing the same.

    • Anonymous

      Agreed. Even the success of iOS itself (iPhone, iPad) as products are almost entirely due to software, the AppStore, how scrolling views feels like manipulating a physical object and so on. It's something people can connect with. 

    • Anonymous

      Agreed. Even the success of iOS itself (iPhone, iPad) as products are almost entirely due to software, the AppStore, how scrolling views feels like manipulating a physical object and so on. It's something people can connect with. 

  • Skye629

    This has got to be the most interesting debate comment page I have read in a long long time hardly any trolling just straight up data and personal opinions, personally here what I say, GET THEM ALL I have a Iphone4, a DS lite, a PSP, PS3, and PS2.  Use IOS for cheap stuff which u can play for a few min while waiting for class to start, then use whatever console, gaming handheld for more classic and popular modern gaming, simple as that, buy both everyone benefits ya?

  • Mike

    Apple is all about hardware too though. They hold back iapd features and make it tied to ios rather than file folders so they can keep selling more revisions and not cannibalize macbookair sales.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      You mean like the.. uh.. keyboard feature that ever so slightly distinguishes an iPad from a Macbook air?

  • Mike

    Great article why this would be bad news -- if apple and nintendo merged:

    http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=9085305

  • Mike

    Here is a question for you guys: why did they casualise the recent sid meiers pirqtes game when the spurce code was already ready and developement put in with the strategic land battles and direct control of sailing? Why did thry twke those features away? Its not like ipad gamers cant handle it. Are they making games for mom and pops now on the iPad?

  • Paul

    We were one of the companies cancelling our 3DS plans. Great Little War Game (http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/great-little-war-game-hd/id426392350?ls=1&mt=8) was actually designed initially for 3DS when we saw the specs. We're also registered devs so getting kit wouldn't have been hard.

    What nailed them for us was simple the draconian way they pay their indie devs. It makes no sense at all for small devs to take a punt on their "appstore", so without that you've got just yet another handheld with games costing epic money. Even if a lot of those games are as good as fanboys make out, I think I'll pass.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      Awesome! Good luck with your iOS dev't

    • Wim Lauryssen

      How are those free dev kits Sony gave you? I'm sure that this didn't influence your post AT ALL.

      • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

        I see not reading TouchArcade anymore is working out awesome for you.

  • poute

    TA you r awesome..when I see these kind of articles such as how Apple has taken over the gaming business and how games like Angry birds and bumpy road are better than say L.A Noire, it really makes my day...Only "Pressing Issues" from vcpr comes close but I guess you are wondering what is vcpr..never mind

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      L.A. Noire is from a single company, and has its own share of issues, even if the Rockstar faithful don't like to talk about them, and it isn't on the Nintendo Wii or 3DS.  And whether you like it or not, one game release selling millions doesn't change the fact that console games are only making up 40% of the market now.  L.A. Noire type releases aren't going to go away anytime soon just because companies like EA are becoming more invested in diversifying to that other 60% of the market now.

  • Mike

    The thing is why would you want tonlay on a small cheap resistive screen (well not cheap in terms of 3d but in terms of touch tech) when you can game on a beautiful portable display with the iPad? Plus it has a much longer battery life and if you buy an iCade it is the ultimate portable retro arcade machine.

    But I get what some of you guys are saying and zive been syaing it all along too, why are so many games ported from other consoles to the iPad casualized, dubbed down or what the devs always call it "made accessible to everyone?" why did they take away the strategic port and city take over in sid meiers pirates and added cannon bombing and even take modes away that existed in the wii version?

    Until Jeff Vogel released Acadon, and has had great success with it despite its high price, there were no even serious western rpgs on the platform. Why is this? The answers to all of this has nothing to do with apple or the actual hardware of the pad, it is all the blame on developers and publisbers. No one is forcing them to play the game of chasing for the bottom or the dollar, they choose to. There is a hardcore market or one could form if they just took some risks. So quit blaming theplatform or apple people. Its not their fault things are the way they are, its the take no risk mentality. Im sick of ign articles or others cobstantly blaming the device when any game on it could work if the right approzch was taken.

    Jeff vogel even said there is a huge number of ppl thanking him for finally bringing something like avadon to the platform.

    http://jeff-vogel.blogspot.com/2011/...ad-hooray.html

    "The genesis of the iPad version was a few months ago, when I said, "Hmmm. I have a few weeks free on my schedule. I think I'll port Avadon to the iPad. That'll be good for a laugh!" I've long known that there was a demand on the device for old school gaming, free of ads, in-game purchases, cute animals, zombies, and farming.

    But, it turns out, the demand was far greater than I'd ever guessed. My fan mail since the release has been very instructive. Gamers weren't just disappointed by the lack of deeper games on the device. They were downright irked.

    But that is the Magic Power of the Indie developer. Find an underserved market and serve it."

  • http://twitter.com/cptnCheesecake kelso

    When I can get Chinatown Wars for $2.99, online FPS like Modern Combat 2, and countless other games for under $5. The thought of $35 portable games does not appeal to me. Even if they have more content, its just nowhere near as good a value. Portable games for near console prices is dead to me.

    • Henshin2000

      Portable console is not dead yet as long as people support it, The purpose of a 40 dollar game is to have a quality game, the race of competition is not also dead yet as long as nintendo has a pokemon games

  • Erik Wilgenhof

    Nintendo is making a classical mistake that can easily cost them the company. They go their own way without looking at the competition. This might have worked with the Wii but at least there they researched and even more important factor; the wishes of the customer. Apple's success is mainly because they look what is popular,copy the idea and improve on it. From a company point of view, catering to the masses is great. From a customer point of view not so much. Problem for Nintendo is that the masses are being served in huge quantities at prices that big N cannot hope to match.

    iGames are like McDonald's food; bland but everyone "is lovin' it". Apple has created the perfect environment and controls it with an iron fist.  Nintendo should not try to encroach on that terrain but leverage the one thing that the DS and every console had that makes gaming a better experience; real controls. Nintendo innovated controls with the Wii but when you get down to it, the Wii is just a Gamecube with some extra controls bolted on. The 3DS is just an NDS with 3D bolted on. In the case of the Wii the extra controls proved to be brilliant and catered to a specific new group. In the case of the 3DS, the implementation is shoddy, the screens are too small and it caters to and existing group that is far more discerning than the Wii pop and mom crowd.

    If Nintendo can find their way (back) into the heart and wallets of "real" gamers and give them the experience that the iDevices can't there is still good money to be made. If they don't want to do that, why not jump on the iBandwagon and start selling games on the iPlatform? I bet they can make millions by releasing past greats like Super Mario or even make a new iMario.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      "iGames are like McDonald's food; bland but everyone "is lovin' it". 

      Dude,wake up... recently 'iGames' as you so cleverly put it are just ports of Nintendo/Sony games. The developers are learning how to make great games on iOS. That's why Apple poses a threat. And that's why first with the 3DS and later with the Wii-U, this could be the most painful generation for Nintendo yet.

  • Relytgninroht

    Well... There is a big difference between indie and garage developers. Nintendo is cool with indie developers, and they have plenty of indie games available on their consoles. If Nintendo wasn't, then we wouldn't have games such as Plants Vs. Zombies, Cave Story, Lost Winds, World of Goo, Cut the Rope, etc. What they mean by garage developers are people that don't make games for a living and do it in their spare time at their house, and know nothing about how game distribution works AKA homebrew developers. 

    As for the 3DS, Nintendo has really done a lousy job marketing it. Most people think its just a 3D DS, and Nintendo hasn't advertised any of its other features, such as AR games, motion controls, and street pass. Another problem it is currently facing is a lack of great games. I think if Nintendo were to distribute 3D movies, and they marketed it as a 3D movie player as well as a game player or whatever, it may appeal to more people. 

    As for iPhone gaming, the major problem with it at the moment is that many games are not worth playing, even for a buck. About 80% of the games released on iOS are shovelware (although it isn't nearly as bad as Android is). Another problem is that it isn't a good way for developers to make money. Several developers and game companies have stated that they don't see the Appstore as a viable market for their games because only a few companies actually make a good profit from it. There has also been a declining interest in gaming exclusively on tablet platforms. A year ago, about 50% of consumers said they wouldn't get a portable gaming device if they bought a tablet. This year however, that number declined to about 25%. The only people who defend the Appstore are the people who make a crapload of money on it, such as Rovio and EA. I love playing games on my iPod, but I just don't see it as a gaming platform, much like PCs. I see them as capable of playing games, but that really isn't its primary purpose. And in the past month, I just haven't seen very many games that I really wanted to buy.

    I personally think the PS Vita is where the future is, because it will have full access to the android marketplace, and all of its games will be both distributed digitally and physically. Plus, it has the most control options out of either of them, and the most unique gameplay features.

  • JacobSchreifels

    You guys that have been saying that ios isn't legitimate because it doesn't have buttons are just saying it because there arent any good arguments against ios and your pissed the gaming industry is changing. The games on ios are getting better and that includes the controls as well. If u want an example of a great game that is just for ios (maybe android?) take a look at battleheart, quality deep rpg like game with outstanding graphics and touch controls that work great, its also better than most games on the 3ds right now.

  • Anonymous

    I'll admit i pretty much skipped through this debate but I will continue to buy anything with mario until the day i die

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      Awesome, cuz the Super Mario Charity Party needs people just like you!

      • Bam

        And Apple dont need people like you.

  • Troof

    Nintendo = Accessible games aimed mainly at Kids.

    IOS = an accidental games system with a sea of really bad games that its credit card indebted user base thinks cost too much.

    Typical Nintendo user = 7 year old boy.

    Typical IOS user = Someone who pays way too much for a phone contract owns multiple credit cards, has no money but thinks that their eyephone makes them look rich.

    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=690747678 Paul Johnson

      Heh, does make me wonder why someone with that opinion found this thread in the first place. :)

      • Troof

        The Troof hurts Paul?

    • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

      Astronauts on the International Space Station could see this burn from orbit.

      • Troof

        Hows that Eli?? not sure I follow you.

  • http://www.facebook.com/barryharmon Barry Harmon

    "Despite all this, Nintendo's Iwata has reiterated that Nintendo has no plans to sell its games to other non-Nintendo platforms. Sega said the same thing."

    In defense of SEGA, they had no plans to put games on other platforms during the 80's and 90's as they obviously had their own home consoles and portables on the market. Their only competition during those times, in terms of portable games, were Nintendo and Atari. There was no platform like the iPhone or Windows Phone, so had they released titles on competitors devices they would be full on cartridges and would most likely be ports of existing games. No way would SEGA have a game like Columns available for both Game Boy and Game Gear. 

    However, once support for the Game Gear ended, SEGA did release titles to portable devices including Tiger's Game.com and SNK's Neo Geo Pocket Color. Both were competing game companies, albeit not in the home console market. And this was in 1998! They still avoided Nintendo until going third party, but that makes complete sense considering the Dreamcast was trying to bring in N64 owners. Wouldn't make sense to support a Nintendo portable at that point.

  • Mike
    • Bobby

      Yep - I liked that comic too. 

      It's telling that hardcore gaming nerds like Penny Arcade have switched to their phones for mobile gaming. 

      I am the same way. I've been an avid gamer for 30 years now. I loved my DS back when I first got it - right after the DS Lite hardware was released. I never play it anymore. It's bulky with a tiny low-res screen compared to my iPhone. $35 games were cheap at the time - console games had gone up to $50-60. But now ... yeah. 

      I still play my PS3, and the iPhone won't replace that anytime soon. But the DS? Yeah, I let my young children play NintenDogs on it mostly these days. And even they would rather play Cut the Rope or something on my iPhone most of the time...... 

      Most of the gaming press still seems to be in denial about the effects of the current mobile gaming market on handheld gaming. This is one of the few articles I saw about the 3DS price cut that made the connection to mobile gaming. It seems obvious to me; I won't be getting one. (Though it's tempting for the 3D version of Ocarina - one of my all-time favorite games and the best Zelda.) 

      Sure there will always be a market for a dedicated device with "actual buttons," but that market is shrinking rapidly. 

  • Onikage725

    The one thing I'm confused on here is why Nintendo's stance iscoming as a
    surprise. Or unique! Do we have Smash Bros on Xbox? Did Halo Wars get a
    PS3 port? Are the big 3 rushing to flood the app store with Uncharted,
    Gears/God of War, Resistence, Zelda, etc? 1st party developers almost
    always keep their stable of franchises close, to sell hardware.

    If anything, this should be a good thing. At least, that's how I
    see. Ok, so we don't get Mario on iDevices. But, what this says to me is
    that Apple is a major player in the console (or w/e) wars. The
    companies are not treating it like just a cell phone casual gaming
    gimmick service. It is treated as a strong, competitive market, by 1st
    and 3rd party devs.

    • Hola

      I agree, Apple has Doodle jump, I cant see this ever being ported, IOS customer base would potentially implode overnight.

      • Onikage725

        I was speaking from the console-makers POV. I don't think Steve Jobs specifically considers him in the gaming business (just that gaming is one of many things his devices can do). Apple isn't so much a "1st party" console/portable gaming dev. When Jobs announces a new iDevice, the slant isn't towards gamers. At the end of the day, the iPod family of devices are media players, smart phones, and tablet PC's. So Apple itself doesn't try to paint itself with one particular brush.

        However, the big gaming companies are recognizing and treating it with the respect of a direct player in their field. Meaning, 1st party titles aren't farmed out, quality of 3rd party titles improving. While Apple may see advanced phones and keyboard-less computers, what a gamer sees is a portable device with multimedia and gaming capabilities. I do a lot of the same things on my CFW PSP as I do on my jailbroken iPad. The iPad is better at non-gaming functions (apps, web, media) and pretty good at games. PSP is better with games (my opinion) and functional in the other categories. They somewhat complement each other. I have emulators on both, I prefer them on PSP. I have book readers, comic readers, custom browsers on both. I prefer them on the iPad. But they are similar, and have similar appeal to a gamer. I bought my Touch because I had a Nano way back when and wanted something for movies and music. I then discovered what it could do... and the gamer in me lead to my iPad purchase.

      • Onikage725

        Forgot to add, I was also just pointing out that it's NOT just Nintendo. I don't think it's fair to repeatedly hear stories about how archaic Nintendo is because they won't develop from the app store until we get Uncharted and Halo on here. It's all of the console devs, because that's how they do business and compete. Microsoft, being a PC company, would be the most likely to dev for the platform. Except for that whole eternal rivalry thing. Then again, you can play Sonic on Nintendo systems. Remember when the idea of that was ludicrous? So who knows what the future holds.

  • http://twitter.com/michaelklopf Michael Klopf

    It would be great to see some Nintendo brands, like Mario or Zelda on iOS. In my opinion Nintendo lacks the quality they had during SNES times. They are raping their brands to death. I found no enjoyment in the DS and I don't feel thrilled to get a 3DS. But I would love to play Ocarina of Time, but buying a 3DS just for this game? No, I don't think that would make sense. Come on Nintendo, open your portfolio to the App Store, at least some classic games, and save the new stuff for your hardware.

    • Rgfangmunroe

      No enjoyment on the DS? I am sorry to hear that. I had loads of fun with Advance Wars, Trauma Center, Dragon Quest, Chrono Trigger, The World Ends With You, Pokemon, New Super Mario Bros (and Mario 64 DS), Mario Kart, Valkyrie Profile, Super Robot Wars W, Retro Game Challenge... just off the top of my head, I have more games than that. I think it was a worthy system. Also think on DSiWare Starship Defense, Soul of Darkness, Cave Story, and X-Scape stand out.

  • wwwfdf

     
    A great festival! I was there the other time with some car insurance colleagues and we never had that much fun before! fake omega