Early this morning Bloomberg ran a story regarding the latest Nintendo 3DS price drop fiasco from a side that you don't often hear from: Investors. As you may recall from the last episode of this mobile gaming financial soap opera, Nintendo President Satoru Iwata has remained vigilant insisting that as long as he is in charge Nintendo will only be making games for its own line of hardware.

Investors don't agree, especially as Nintendo stocks dip to six-year lows. Specifically, Masamitsu Ohki, a fund manager for a Tokyo-based investment management company explains: “Smartphones are the new battlefield for the gaming industry, Nintendo should try to either buy its way into this platform or develop something totally new.”

The best example of how badly investors want the big N to get involved in smartphone gaming came in early July when we caught wind of a potential Pokemon game coming to the iPhone. This caused Nintendo stock to rocket up the most it had in four months, although gains were quickly lost when Nintendo announced that it was not involved with this Pokemon release.

On this news, Japanese investment firm MF Global FXA Securities Ltd. released a note explaining that “They just don’t get it,” urging investors to sell Nintendo stock "because a management once feted for creative out-of-box thinking have just shown how behind the times they are.” Other financial megaminds are insisting that Nintendo use its $10b cash stockpile to acquire companies to help them position themselves better in the changing face of mobile gaming.

It remains to be seen what if any effect the 3DS price drop will have both on player adoption rates as well as Nintendo stock prices. While the system itself may be cheaper, a lower price point doesn't change the fact that consumers as a whole have gone cold on 3D, one of the main selling points of the system. Similarly, the 3DS software library is still as bleak as it ever was, with no respite on the horizon until Super Mario 3D Land and Mario Kart 7 hit this holiday season, which seems like forever compared to the fast-paced world of the App Store where great games are released on a daily basis.

Most, if not all of us at TouchArcade grew up on Nintendo platforms and likely wouldn't be here today if it wasn't for the NES, the SNES, and the market that Nintendo essentially forged out of the video game crashes of the late 70's and early 80's. It's sad to see a company losing their way, and I'm honestly not entirely sure how Nintendo's dedicated portable gaming devices and $40 games can compete in a world flooded with capable smartphones in hundreds of millions of pockets and enough 99¢ (and free) content available to last a lifetime.

I think we all knew the days of the dedicated portable gaming device were numbered, but I'm not sure any of us expected this would come so soon.

[via Bloomberg, MacRumors]

  • Wut

    "Great games on a daily basis." Sorry, but virtually no truly 'great' games (at least comparable to games such as Mario Kart 7 + Super Mario 3D Land assuming they are as good as their universally acclaimed predecessors) have been released in the same caliber for iOS yet, and even so they are normally months apart, similar to 3DS/PSP/Whatever game cycles. Unless you're prepared to call games such as "Wacky Leaks" and "Destroy Gunners SP" to be in the same league as Ocarina of Time 3D, then you're wrong.

    • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

      The point is you can be playing a fun new game on a daily basis for free or close to it, compared to sitting on your hands and marking days off your calendar to Mario Kart being released.

      • Shrugemoff

        No I think the real point to this article is the fact that websites like this and a few others can't get it through their thick skulls that the Pokemon game for iOS wasn't being released by Nintendo. It was being released by the Pokemon Company, who can do things like that. Nintendo just needs to come up with their own smartphone and Apple, if it thinks that Nintendo would be stupid enough to give them 30%, needs to go screw themselves.

      • Matt S.

        No, the REAL point of the article is that investors think Nintendo is stuck in the past and are telling people to sell their stock if they won't position to get their software into the phone arenas.  This has nothing to do with "this site" or Apple.  

      • Shrugemoff

        Really then why does This Site say that Nintendo needs (and that their investors are saying) to get games onto the iOS. Which is not what the article is saying. Nintendo does need to get started with their own mobile device and marketplace, but if Apple thinks that Nintendo is stupid enough to give them 30% then I repeat my first "Screw you Apple".

      • Sildedaspo

        Somebody *cough cough shrugemoff* has an unprecedented boner for nintendo.

      • Shrugemoff

        No I don't actually. I like both companies just fine but think that Apple shouldn't be let in on the profits of a company that's been around a few years before them and definitely shouldn't make a profit on Icons that have made Nintendo a household name. Please try and make your responses not sound like a nine year old that just found his dad's Playboy magazines. Plus you don't even need the word unprecedented before boner. Just because I like a company (and have played their games for years) doesn't mean I have a hard on for them. But it seems to show that you have one for Apple considering you're using the lowest form of language to defend them.

      • Roger

        So, you don't understand how rudimentary economics works? It sounds like you are saying that Apple should invite Nintendo to publish iOS games on Apple devices and expect no percentage for doing so. Is that what you are saying?

      • Shrugemoff

        No what I'm saying is that Nintendo, if they're going to enter the smartphone gaming market, should develop their own device and marketplace for it. They shouldn't allow Apple to have anything to do with their iconic characters that have brought them so much money to this point. The only reason Sega ever started allowing their games on other systems was because their biggest mascot was Sonic the Hedgehog. Nintendo has Mario, Luigi, Princess Peach, Bowser, Link, Zelda, Kirby, Fox, Donkey, etc. They don't need anyone's help in making or publishing games. You just have to take a look at the Philips CD-i to see how it's a bad idea for Nintendo to allow another company to have their characters on another system.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        That's the same thing as them putting out the 3DS.  If it's an exclusive marketplace with Nintendo's draconian online feature set, there's virtually no distinction between how it is now except that the device will be a phone and lose the buttons.  You still have to build up a user base whenever you go solo, whereas Apple already has hundreds of millions of devices in peoples hands RIGHT NOW.  Nintendo could still keep their flagship titles from this generation on their device while releasing an enormous back catalog in the form of their Virtual Console offerings on smart phones.  It would rake in money and please their investors, but they're too stubborn to let go.

      • Anonymous

        they invented the business. Apple is a great competitor, it's doing a great job telling people this thing is good for games, even if most games are closer to atari gaming than 21th century gaming.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        And they're going to lose it if they don't adapt to the changing future.  Just because you did something first doesn't mean you're always going to come out on top and live forever.  You'd think the Playstation era would have humbled them a bit, but then they got lucky with the DS and Wii gimmicks catching the casual and youth crowd once.  The problem is they don't realize it was a one-time flash burn success.  Grandma isn't going to buy the Wii U now that she has her Wii Sports machine to pull out for the grand kids, and mommy is going to hesitate to buy her kid a new 3DS if he just got a DS Lite or DSi last Christmas.  They need to diversify to the currently popular technology rather than stubbornly press on with their misguided idea of what people want today.  The strength of their software could still live on even outside their hardware.

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        You mean like Chaos Rings? Rage HD? Those Atari games?

      • http://twitter.com/AnthonyM122 Anthony Mangiarciana

        They won't let go because they still want to rape all their customers even with those old titles for years to come. They will sell them on the Wii U, on the Wii, on the DSi and the 3DS and their newer stuff for probably the next decade. They are not interested in selling those titles for 10 dollars a piece and then giving Apple 30 percent off the top. Especially since I have to assume they will all need some work to be done to them to be able to play them with a touch screen and no buttons.

      • Sildedaspo

        Agreeing with Roger, maybe you should come into a conversation with more than a "9 year old's" understanding of how the iOS market works.

      • Sildedaspo

        AS well, i don't need the word unprecedented but I put it in there anyways, its an adjective. Ever learn about those in grade school?

      • Shrugemoff

        Yeah I did a**hole and I also learned that using a word like boner makes you sound less intelligent. Which must be the reason you found an intelligent word online, that had nothing to do with the word after it, and decided to use it in your post. Using smart words doesn't make an idiot any smarter.

      • Sildedaspo

        Hahaha. Woah. Look at the guy who spends so much time yelling at his computer screen. :b

      • Shrugemoff

        Says the guy that said I had a boner for Nintendo. Why don't you go f**k yourself. I understand that Apple gets 30% of what Nintendo should be getting all of. Apple doesn't deserve any money coming from Nintendo's characters.

      • Shrugemoff

        Says the guy that said I had a boner for Nintendo. Why don't you go f**k yourself. I understand that Apple gets 30% of what Nintendo should be getting all of. Apple doesn't deserve any money coming from Nintendo's characters.

      • Shrugemoff

        Says the guy that said I had a boner for Nintendo. Why don't you go f**k yourself. I understand that Apple gets 30% of what Nintendo should be getting all of. Apple doesn't deserve any money coming from Nintendo's characters.

      • Anonymous

        So, Apple does not deserve compensation for the services they provide developers? It costs money, you know, to run such a large infrastructure. Your attitude is completely asinine.

      • Sildedaspo

        Then how is nintendo going to get those characters onto iDevices? Thats what this is all about. No 30%; no mario on ipod. what are you even arguing for right now? Is you self esteem so low that you sit at your email waiting for people to reply to your message threads so that you can engage in message board conflict? Somebody get this man a life!

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_QCP4WHWLUQHFIOP66SLEA7E5CA Hampus

        You know, if they started selling Mario Kart in the iOS appstore for say 15$ or maybe even $10 they'd get 70% of that, that's probably going to be as much if not more than they get for selling it for the NDS for $30-35 at retail stores where the retailer and the supplier (who sold the games to the retailer) take a very large part of the sales price.

        If standard retail practices isnt enough for you, look at it like this.
        To develop and release apps/games for iOS you'll have to pay $99/year plus the 30% of each app sold.
        To develop and release WiiWare titles you need to pay for a $2000 development kit (and not just anyone can but one) and you have to pay to get the game rated by esrb and such for every region before you can release it. And then there is Nintendos approval process that is far stricter than Apples...

        It's the way it works, and when it comes to these deal, Apples 30% cut is actually a pretty darn good deal when you really look at it...

      • http://twitter.com/Skavingere Skavinger

        I agree with Hampus.  In this instance, in terms of profit and economics, the investors are right.  I respect Shrugemoff's fervor for Nintendo, but I feel down about the 3DS guys.  I'm a fan of good games, period; it's the reason why I'm a total consumer whore and own every gaming system known to man, including the 3DS.  Now, while I'm still holding out hope for the 3DS, and Nintendo's numerous beloved IPs, I'm really beginning to feel disillusioned with it in its current state.  In 2006-2007, I would have been enamored with the Virtual Console and the eShop, but now, having been spoiled by the elegance, plentiful offerings, and streamlined-UI-experience of the App Store, the eShop, a post-AppStore virtual marketplace, seems rather second-rate and clunky to me (so does the Wii's Virtual store, for that matter), and so does its various WiFi-based features (whereby my iPhone 4 runs laps around the 3DS in terms of online experience).

        Of course, I didn't get the 3DS for its eShop or its online features: I got it for its IPs, and right now, there is a conspicuous lack of new iterations of these ubiquitous franchises (even though I know they're on their way).  I'm still waiting for that killer 3DS game, even though I love Ocarina 3D (it's more of a re-polished old game). 

        What adds to my angst is the fact that the 3DS had a recent price-drop to 170 bones, whereas I paid the full 250 (stupidly, you may argue) when it was first released (early-adopter syndrome).  On top of that, retail giant GameSpot is offering its members 100-dollar 3DSes for trade-ins of ANY DS Lite-and-up that any portable gamer probably already owns.  Say what?  It's just a sign that this mobile console is in trouble.  More than feeling defensive or argumentative about the 3DS, I feel a bit bummed out about it.  Personally, I feel it'd be awesome to see some of Nintendo's IPs in the AppStore, especially if it marks a boon to their stocks and profits in the long haul.

      • http://twitter.com/AnthonyM122 Anthony Mangiarciana

        Actually the retailer will get 2-4 dollars tops for a new game title. Anyone else in that food chain gets even less then that. No one is getting anywhere near 30 percent even combined. Also like I stated before Nintendo will also be spending time and money altering these titles to work with a touch only interface. I doubt that would be very appealing to them with the way they operate. I understand why they don't want to help build up the Iphone, they feel that if this market continues to grow their own handhelds will not be able to sell games at 39.99 and they have more raping to do.

        Now that said if I was them I would definitely do something with the GB/C/A and Nes/Snes titles. They could continue to use the N64 and Gamecube and even lesser selling Wii titles for their new consoles stores. They could make a metric F-Ton of money on those old 8-16 bit titles. Who cares if Apple gets a cut, it is a cut of income that Nintendo is probably not going to ever see from this segment of the gaming population. I know people who love their Iphone gaming so much that this is the only game console they have. They used to have a Gameboy and a Sega or PS1 in their homes. Not anymore.

      • vimy

        yeah,

        its better to give walmart 50 percent and then pay them extra for preferred store space, only to have them send back unsold and returned units for full compensation

        ... or maybe the appstore isnt as bad as retailers

      • Shrugemoff

        Says the guy that said I had a boner for Nintendo. Why don't you go f**k yourself. I understand that Apple gets 30% of what Nintendo should be getting all of. Apple doesn't deserve any money coming from Nintendo's characters.

      • iDocta

        Wow.. first intelligent reply lol.. You get a prize for actually READING the article

      • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

        No kidding.

      • Anonymous

        The Pokemon company is OWNED by Nintendo. It is an affiliate of Nintendo jointly owned with Game Freak. Game Freak has been a second party developer of Nintendo's for years.

        Yes they released a Sega PICO 'title' and a couple PC 'titles' which serve as ads for Pokemon like this app will. Sega and Nintendo get along quite well though and Sega has developed some games for Nintendo. Nintendo released a wi-fi peripheral and makes screen savers for PC, just not games.

        What I'm saying is this Pokemon app is not as harmless as you are anybody is saying that it is. It's a trojan horse for testing the waters. Testing how development, distribution, and market penetration works on iOS and Android

      • Anonymous

        The Pokemon Company is co-owned by Nintendo and now 2nd party dev of the Pokemon games. I don't buy the official line, this app is designed to test the waters. It's designed to see what development and distribution is like on both platforms and advertise Pokemon at the same time.
        Yes they released a Sega Pico title and PC titles but that's not shocking considering their relationship with Sega and also that they make flash mini-games and screensavers on PC

      • Anonymous

        I have an iPad, iPhone and 3DS. I consider myself a core gamer. iPhone and iPad are good for games for a few minutes. Ah la angry birds style. I knew they're deep games for the iOS but none have really drawn me in. The only issue with the 3ds is the lack of games. PSP and 3DS games have so much production value compared to iOS games. The big competition is why would I spend $40 on a 3DS game when XBLA has equally as much production value at a fraction of the price. Shadow Complex vs Metroid. Metroid is better but Shadow Complex is so so so good. At least better than other M

      • Anonymous

        Gabe and Tycho nailed this argument.

        http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2011/8/1/

      • Anonymous

        yeah 40 shitty mini games. That's called Mario Party or Wario Ware for Nintendo. I'm still waiting for the next Angry Birds.

    • Anonymous

      it would be a great idea to bring Nintendo games to the iphone at leat so people will realize how bad the mp3 player is as a gaming platform. yu can only do so much with tilting.And I love my iphone.

    • zeldafanboy23ify

      Man, Apple is like Activision, making the same sh*t every year with small tweaks here and there, a better analogy would be that the iPhone/iTouch is like Call of Duty, there company's keep milking the crap out of them

    • PBSMAN

      Dont even try to reason with them, this site is full of Apple fanboys.

    • John Smith999

      No, but Assassins Creed was alot better on iPhone than DS... as was GTA: chinatown wars... and Civilisation revolution.  Nintendo is over-rated anyway, I can live without Zelda or Pokemon (thats why Gameloft exist to copy Zelda). Oh, sorry I forgot you have Rayman 3D. Oh wait, I have had the exact same remake game on my iPhone for at least a year. It even works perfectly on that old under-powered original iPhone I still have in a draw somewhere. If that is one of the best games Nintendo hardware can manage... I think I shall pass. 

      • Anonymous

        bullshit, chinatown wars is garbage with a touch screen, I cannot and willnot  play feature game son a phone, my psp/3ds does it just fine. I see the comic that says  well see how much fun you have if i buy 40 iphone games for 40 dollars and you ahve one 3ds game, but honestly, Id never play that many crappy ios games in my lifetime, and shitty games like angry birds and  puzzlequest only keep me excited for so long. 

  • http://twitter.com/Sanuku Sanuku

    Well now it`s Nintendos turn to either jump on the Mobile Train or do the same as Electronic Arts did when they realise that they need to do something - Buy you in as Electronic Arts did. And as we all know already Ubisoft/Gameloft and Chillingo/Clickgamer/Electronic Arts are currently almost making more net profit then from their PC Division.

    Honestly if Nintendo doesn`t do something right now and wait longer they might be to late for the Party.

  • Briker Ed

    Crossing my fingers that Nintendo finally gives in. If they do it, soon more console developers might follow, which in term benefits us, the smartphone gamers. I can see why they all want to stick to individual consoles, but I'm guessing it's becoming a hassle owning multiple portable systems. Personally, I'll opt for leaving my 3DS at home and taking my smartphone with me when I go out, even if it means I'm only able to play 3DS games at home, when and if I have the will to. It's just less of a hassle. Also, the smartphone apps/games have gone a long way from being simple Flash-like games.

  • TOMNfoeiwf

    Yeah, sorry, but I'm saving up for an iPhone 5...maybe I'll get a 3DS at some point, I don't know.  $40 can get me at least 15 or 20 unique, creative games on the iPhone.  Sure, you don't get Nintendo quality, but if I want that, I'll play on a console.  Consoles have another few years yet.

  • Guest

    The bottom line is... Nintendo aren't in trouble, not even close. "Six-year low" stocks means practically nothing, they weren't exactly poverty-stricken back in 2005.

    • HisDivineOrder

      They're "in trouble" not because they're going out of business tomorrow, but because their long range strategy appears to be to bury their heads in the sand and keep doing the same old, same old, expecting in a mad way that the market will change back to the way it was before they introduced the DS and Wii as the ticket to getting a "whole new market of gamers" into this whole gaming thing.  Those gamers were the casual gamers and the DS and Wii spent a good portion of their time pushing Nintendo at these gamers.

      Then these gamers wound up buying iPhone's and found free/$1 games.  Suddenly (and curiously), DS games began to sell far less well than they had.  Then the iPad showed up and around the same time the Wii coincidentally began to look really ancient next to 720p consoles (that often run at less, but certainly not 480p).  Plus, the iPad was there luring them away from occupying their TV when they could watch TV and play Angry Birds simultaneously instead...

      Nintendo is in trouble not because they're going to be sold to Apple for $2 tomorrow, but because Nintendo does NOT get that $40 games for $170 hardware is going to work only SLIGHTLY better than $40 games for $250 hardware.  And it'll work less well for Nintendo who probably won't even be making a profit on hardware sold this go-round at the new $170 price point... (DS and Wii sold for a profit, unlike the 360 and PS3 for much of their generation.)

      Nintendo doesn't realize the market has changed.  They ushered in the era of casual gaming and Apple snuck in, snatching them away while Nintendo was busy crafting yet another Super Mario...

      That's why investors were so down on the Wii U at its announcement at E3 that Nintendo's stock actually went down.  Haha, I remember Nintendo's Prez going, "What, why did our stock go down?" in an interview after that.  Of course, it's because investors see now that Nintendo not only has no viable strategy for dealing with the way the market is now versus the way it once was... but that they're making the same mistakes they already made before (overpriced, too many ports from third parties, gimmicks that don't excel compared to the competitors, nothing new in control scheme (nothing up to stylus-based gaming when DS released or waggle-based control when Wii released), etc.)

      Apple will have made the iPad Airplaying into AppleTV mainstream by next year around when Nintendo shows up, lets people see it, and is crestfallen by the fact everyone is saying, "Yeah, I did this at home on my iPad a few months ago, it's awesome... but... don't you got anything else?"

      • Anonymous

        I was a Nintendo fanboy when I was younger. I love their games to death and I'm still a huge fan. I buy all their hardware including Virtual Boy and I did get a 3DS.

        I agree with everything you're saying. I was skeptical of the original DS until I tried one, so the same may hold true for Wii U but I doubt it. It's a 360/PS3-level device (six years too late) with a 480p resistive touchscreen controller that offers up a DS like experience and also a portable onlive experience. No thanks. But I'll try it. 

        Most good DS games are not casual or touch-heavy (except for the two Zeldas). The casual stuff has migrated on to the app store, some are even DS ports (or clones). That leaves the touchscreen under utilized and the 2nd screen a place to stick a map or a HUD. It's pretty useless. Same thing with Wii. All those possibilities but still no Star Wars lightsabre game. You can waggle through most games. Didn't see much match Wii Sports baseball in terms of 1:1 even with the under-supported motionplus. Games like DKCR and NSMB has motion shamelessly tacked on. What I'm saying is that the experience offered by the Wii U might be unique and different, but judging by their past it will be under-utilized especially with 3rd party ports. It will only serve to play HD Nintendo games which I'm fine with, but nobody else will be. The casual thing is dead, at least in terms of the Wii. People will be wondering why it still has to use a controller. Kinect is actually kind of fun despite the limits and the lag. Nintendo would be silly to copy them but the masses will be confused if they don't.

        Nintendo games on the app store would be great. DS ports with retina display would even be great, like a retina Mario Kart with better textures and game center support (minus snaking) would make my day. I'd pay $20 for it. My wife loves Animal Crossing and all the iOS clones are fremium crap. Nintendogs, she loves that too. The dog games even on DS don't come close. I have a 3DS to play these on, I just would prefer to play on my phone which is always with me.

        Every time I say that somebody says "I take my DS everywhere I go". Good for you. If you're older than 12, it's not normal. Especially for adults. I would get ridiculed, and getting ridiculed is uncomfortable. Plus it's cumbersome in comparison.

      • sniPyro

        I don't know who the hell you hang out with, but no one I know would ridicule for someone over 12 for bringing a DS. Now that's what I called childish arrogance. 

        Am I allowed to call anyone who plays Angry Birds under 8? No.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YYO2NCKWQZ5VMJ4QTY2P7BW2FU bob

        lol, I've never in my life seen anyone over 18 in a public place playing a DS.  Now if I did, I certainly wouldn't ridicule them, but the fact still remains I've never seen it.  Now the iphone otoh, is ALL OVER THE PLACE.  I carry mine everywhere and I play games on it constantly. 

      • http://www.facebook.com/sirvictory SrBilyon Maximillion Marcel Ha

        You should go to an anime convention or a tech convention then.

      • http://twitter.com/michaelklopf Michael Klopf

        Great comment.

        You have to go where the market is and it is in the App Store. Nintendo with their average hardware know-how (look at the 3DS) won't be able to pull off a phone or anything like that which could be a new mass product. I'm not sure where the company is heading, but before Microsoft is buying it, Apple should do it.

        It's only a mind game, but Apple could do it. Managing it as a satellite company. Securing their game development division and IPs. Developing a new design for the Game Boy for the hardcore gamers with buttons etc. But making it right.

        Furthermore they have to get good personal from the video game industry, for example Phil Harrison, to help developing a strategy for Nintendo.

        Then developing and releasing old school games for the App Store.

        Apple can do this all alone and without them (but I think they are not seriously interested in gaming), but they lack know-how in the gaming industry. The games in the App Store are a success but really great games/system sellers are almost completely missing. Take Gameloft, they couldn't sell their crap on any other platform.

        I would love the combination of iPhone + old school Nintendo games.

    • HisDivineOrder

      They're "in trouble" not because they're going out of business tomorrow, but because their long range strategy appears to be to bury their heads in the sand and keep doing the same old, same old, expecting in a mad way that the market will change back to the way it was before they introduced the DS and Wii as the ticket to getting a "whole new market of gamers" into this whole gaming thing.  Those gamers were the casual gamers and the DS and Wii spent a good portion of their time pushing Nintendo at these gamers.

      Then these gamers wound up buying iPhone's and found free/$1 games.  Suddenly (and curiously), DS games began to sell far less well than they had.  Then the iPad showed up and around the same time the Wii coincidentally began to look really ancient next to 720p consoles (that often run at less, but certainly not 480p).  Plus, the iPad was there luring them away from occupying their TV when they could watch TV and play Angry Birds simultaneously instead...

      Nintendo is in trouble not because they're going to be sold to Apple for $2 tomorrow, but because Nintendo does NOT get that $40 games for $170 hardware is going to work only SLIGHTLY better than $40 games for $250 hardware.  And it'll work less well for Nintendo who probably won't even be making a profit on hardware sold this go-round at the new $170 price point... (DS and Wii sold for a profit, unlike the 360 and PS3 for much of their generation.)

      Nintendo doesn't realize the market has changed.  They ushered in the era of casual gaming and Apple snuck in, snatching them away while Nintendo was busy crafting yet another Super Mario...

      That's why investors were so down on the Wii U at its announcement at E3 that Nintendo's stock actually went down.  Haha, I remember Nintendo's Prez going, "What, why did our stock go down?" in an interview after that.  Of course, it's because investors see now that Nintendo not only has no viable strategy for dealing with the way the market is now versus the way it once was... but that they're making the same mistakes they already made before (overpriced, too many ports from third parties, gimmicks that don't excel compared to the competitors, nothing new in control scheme (nothing up to stylus-based gaming when DS released or waggle-based control when Wii released), etc.)

      Apple will have made the iPad Airplaying into AppleTV mainstream by next year around when Nintendo shows up, lets people see it, and is crestfallen by the fact everyone is saying, "Yeah, I did this at home on my iPad a few months ago, it's awesome... but... don't you got anything else?"

    • HisDivineOrder

      They're "in trouble" not because they're going out of business tomorrow, but because their long range strategy appears to be to bury their heads in the sand and keep doing the same old, same old, expecting in a mad way that the market will change back to the way it was before they introduced the DS and Wii as the ticket to getting a "whole new market of gamers" into this whole gaming thing.  Those gamers were the casual gamers and the DS and Wii spent a good portion of their time pushing Nintendo at these gamers.

      Then these gamers wound up buying iPhone's and found free/$1 games.  Suddenly (and curiously), DS games began to sell far less well than they had.  Then the iPad showed up and around the same time the Wii coincidentally began to look really ancient next to 720p consoles (that often run at less, but certainly not 480p).  Plus, the iPad was there luring them away from occupying their TV when they could watch TV and play Angry Birds simultaneously instead...

      Nintendo is in trouble not because they're going to be sold to Apple for $2 tomorrow, but because Nintendo does NOT get that $40 games for $170 hardware is going to work only SLIGHTLY better than $40 games for $250 hardware.  And it'll work less well for Nintendo who probably won't even be making a profit on hardware sold this go-round at the new $170 price point... (DS and Wii sold for a profit, unlike the 360 and PS3 for much of their generation.)

      Nintendo doesn't realize the market has changed.  They ushered in the era of casual gaming and Apple snuck in, snatching them away while Nintendo was busy crafting yet another Super Mario...

      That's why investors were so down on the Wii U at its announcement at E3 that Nintendo's stock actually went down.  Haha, I remember Nintendo's Prez going, "What, why did our stock go down?" in an interview after that.  Of course, it's because investors see now that Nintendo not only has no viable strategy for dealing with the way the market is now versus the way it once was... but that they're making the same mistakes they already made before (overpriced, too many ports from third parties, gimmicks that don't excel compared to the competitors, nothing new in control scheme (nothing up to stylus-based gaming when DS released or waggle-based control when Wii released), etc.)

      Apple will have made the iPad Airplaying into AppleTV mainstream by next year around when Nintendo shows up, lets people see it, and is crestfallen by the fact everyone is saying, "Yeah, I did this at home on my iPad a few months ago, it's awesome... but... don't you got anything else?"

  • NotMe

    I'm completely opposite. Been playing with my DS and Wii most of the summer; have an iPod touch full of games and iTunes full of 3000 disposable games, and I only really care about a handful of those. But my console games get treated with much more respect, I spend my time and decide which to buy. The only mobile game I've been using regularly between my interludes has been Tiny Tower and it's a free one.
    So if Nintendo releases an App, I'll play with it a bit, but forget about it afterwards like many of my purchases.

    • Anonymous

      Perhaps buy iphone games more carefully and buy more of the high caliber titles?
      Seriously I have mountains of good games on my ipad, and it's for sure kept me from pulling the trigger and buying a 3DS.

  • http://twitter.com/mguniverse Danny Perski

    Nintendo + iPhone 4 with retina display = Super Mario Bros with NO VISIBLE PIXELS.

    • http://twitter.com/Skavingere Skavinger

      Haha, I especially like the "no visible pixels" part.  "NOTE to developer: If I see a pixel, you die."

  • wizard

    Eventually Nintendo will release their own convergence device with physical controls (the only way to play something like, for instance, Super Mario Bros. 3). Releasing iOS games when they've just released new handheld hardware is insane.

    • HisDivineOrder

      Only insane if they continue pushing the 3DS instead of ending support and switching to iOS/Android development.  They could stop having to manufacture and support hardware, switching to software-only development.  They've never really pushed the envelope of graphics/sound/technology, so fitting their games into the technical limitations of the iPad and/or iPhone shouldn't be that hard.

      This is assuming they'd just get out of the hardware business altogether and focus on software.  I'm assuming they're NOW actually losing money on making the 3DS (unlike the Wii and the DS where they made money on each device sold), so they have to recoup some of that cost from game sales.  If true, they could dump the hardware and let Apple/Google worry about that while they just make games.

      Great, awesomely nostalgic games.  That we can have on a thinner device with far better battery life than any Nintendo's made in years.

    • Anonymous

      The virtual stick the Capcom licenses to use in its games (which I think is called Virtual Pad) would totally be able to play Mario 3. I think a lot of us played Mega Man 2 when it came out and decided the platform couldn't handle it. That's not true, MM2's controls just suck horribly. I play Ghost and Goblins on the harder mode and don't blame the virtual stick for when I die. The now-abandoned emulators have mostly terrible controls too not unlike Mega Man 2.

      Just remember, Sega abandoned Dreamcast pretty darn fast, first via Acclaim with Crazy Taxi less then 2 years after launch

  • squirrel squirrel squirrel

    While I wish no harm on Nintendo, and I hope they are able to figure out some compelling hardware that keeps gamers interested, remember that a company going purely software has happened before in the industry. Sega used to be a hardware company, and now you can play Sonic titles on Nintendo (and other platforms) hardware.  12-year-old me would never have believed you if you'd told me that.

  • http://twitter.com/mguniverse Danny Perski

    Nintendo is looking more like the Sega of the 21st century, and honestly, that's ok. They make good games, and that's all they need to do. I just want them on my phone, not a big gaming machine in my pocket. 

  • http://twitter.com/mguniverse Danny Perski

    Nintendo is looking more like the Sega of the 21st century, and honestly, that's ok. They make good games, and that's all they need to do. I just want them on my phone, not a big gaming machine in my pocket. 

  • http://twitter.com/mguniverse Danny Perski

    Nintendo is looking more like the Sega of the 21st century, and honestly, that's ok. They make good games, and that's all they need to do. I just want them on my phone, not a big gaming machine in my pocket. 

  • http://twitter.com/mguniverse Danny Perski

    Nintendo is looking more like the Sega of the 21st century, and honestly, that's ok. They make good games, and that's all they need to do. I just want them on my phone, not a big gaming machine in my pocket. 

  • Justin California

    Note... Nintendo's games and games that are brought to the 3DS do have a longer development cycle because there going for a complete experiences that lasts. In the other hand few iOS games stick with gamers after an hour. I've played Super Smash Bros and MArio Kart for nearly 100 hours with friends online and offline!!! I played 9mm on the iphone for 2 hours as i was getting pissed at the touch controls!!!

    • Justin

      In other words... Developers know this and its shown in several games. iOS games are meant to be short experiences. While the Pokemon games are played for a much longer experience.... we're talking about 50+ hours. Plus. The app store gets in about 20 new games a day... that's 7300 games a year... 7200 of which are pure garbage and are filled with glitches and bugs!!!

      • HisDivineOrder

        I think it was Penny Arcade that said, "You buy one random game for 3DS for $40 and I'll buy my 40 $1 games on iPhone and we'll see which of us has more fun."

        I'm just not convinced many of the 3DS titles released thus far warrant $40.  Even Zelda, which is just a port of a great game from Nintendo 64 that has already been ported to other consoles previously (not surprised it didn't do as well as Nintendo had hoped).

        I think I wound up paying $1-5 for GTA: Chinatown Wars, $1 for Dead Space, $1 for NBA Jam, $1 for NOVA, $1 for NOVA 2, $1 for Asphalt 5, etc...

        I think comparing random titles in the App Store to very specific titles that aren't even released yet on 3DS and won't be for a few months still (so you don't even know how good they are) is an odd argument.

        You say, "that's 7300 games a year... 7200 of which are pure garbage and are filled with glitches and bugs!!!" and I say, "3DS has gotten 20-50 titles so far and 19-49 are pure garbage, some even filled with glitches and bugs!!!"

        We're both right.  Of course, what you consider garbage and I consider garbage are subjective arguments, but I think $40 garbage is a LOT more offensive than $1 or free garbage.

    • http://twitter.com/michaelklopf Michael Klopf

      This could be because 9mm is a bad game, like almost all Gameloft games are. But people don't see it because on the App Store it's still a novelty.

      There are great games out there with good touch controls. For example NBA Jam, GTA Chinatown Wars (I played that through without any problem), Zenonia (and that's almost like old school Zelda), Gesundheit, Death Really, Touchgrind (BMX) etc.

      Mario Kart on a touchscreen should be possible.

  • Anonymous

    If you read the actual translation of the quotes from investors, nowhere does it say Nintendo is "Facing Investor Pressure to Bring Games to iPhone". The Bloomberg report was linkbait and so is this post. You're better than this TouchArcade. The quote in question, which you include in your article, just says an investor is pressuring Nintendo to get into the mobile game by either "buying its way into this platform or develop something totally new." That means they want Nintendo to enter the hardware market; Nintendo wouldn't have to buy it's way in anywhere in regards to it's game library. Apple would fall all over itself to have Nintendo's games on iOS.

  • Nintendo Sucks.

    I would never buy a Nintendo DS, 3DS, etc. But I would love to see some nintendo games on iPhone. Like Mario, Zelda, Etc. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1628203214 Adam Holden

    Nintendo doesn't realize or doesn't want to admit that Apple is one officially-sanctioned bluetooth gamepad away from annihilating them. The only thing keeping them alive is Steve Jobs's button stigma.

    • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

      It doesn't even need to be an official gamepad as much as they just need to roll support for the HID bluetooth profile into an iOS update, then you can use whatever gamepad you want including the Wii controller, PS3, controller, and various other gamepads.

    • Anonymous

      Nintendo should make the controller, and sell apps to go with it.

    • Anonymous

      Nintendo should make the controller, and sell apps to go with it.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      The iPhone is the gamepad. Game over, Japan. All your industry are belong to....us.

  • Austinriddle87

    Let me put this in a different perspective of how CONVIENIENCE TRUMPS QUALITY.  I've had a DS for 3 years with an R4 card.  That means any DS game I want I can get free.  But even with these free titles my iPhone 3GS and iPhone 4 'not jailbroken" have seen WAY more game time than my DS. 

    Also don't act like there's loads of great portable nintendo games.  They flood the market with 90% garbage too, but at least the garbage doesn't cost $40 on iPhone.  Half a decade run with a handful of good titles.  Yes I'm looking at you New Super Mario Brothers that costs $50 and takes just under an hour to beat.

    • Jon

      Yeah, same here. I have a DS Lite and access to any of its titles for free, but I never play it. I do play my iPhone games though. Nothing beats NBA Jam and Super Stickman Golf!

    • Anonymous

      I agree with everything that you are saying, however there is yet to be a single iOS game, specifically platformers, that has game mechanics as good as NSMB.

    • sniPyro

      I find it weird that anyone who talks about pirating iOS games is hammered here by mods like IMNS. (Which is of course, understandable) But this comment is acceptable and has 7 likes? 

      ...Right, I'll say to you what people here say to people who pirate iOS games. You pirate games, so your opinion is null. 

      Don't act like pirating is fine just because it's Nintendo, not Apple.

      • S Ramisetty

        It's so true. It's kinda disturbing and looks really bad for Touch arcade. Especially with the title being click-bait.

  • Rococoman

    On one hand, I really want to stick by Nintendo; the DS had some absolutely great games, and I am sure that, eventually, the 3DS will also. When it comes to gameplay, they really do just "get it." Time and time again, they create new genres of gaming and, in that same introductory step, present the best way to play it. Mario 64, every Zelda game, every Mario Kart... they've aged so well thanks to how well they were planned.

    However, I cringe at Nintendo's "gate-keeping." Reggie, Nintendo of America's president, repeatedly makes comments about "preserving quality experiences" on their consoles. If you were to remove the top 10% of games on Nintendo consoles - almost all 1st party efforts, most likely - you would be left with a wasteland that the App Store would be embarrassed to be compared to. Nintendo's downloadable services are vastly worse. How can they turn away ambitious, independent developers while allowing some of the garbage that appears in their stores? Who looked at "Panda Craze" (check it out http://dsiware.nintendolife.com/reviews/2011/02/panda_craze_dsiware) and said "this... this is a quality experience." ?

    I love Nintendo products, but I can't support them if they are simply trying to keep the industry to themselves and their buddies. If they indeed end up losing their hold on the gaming market (unlikely), it will be a lose for video gamers, indeed, but one that could have and should have been avoided.

  • Awesome

    @headline
    >:D

  • Relytgninroht

    I think that if Nintendo were to release an iPhone game, it would probably be a very short lackluster spinoff title. I mean really, have we seen anything that is super great from console publishers and developers? There are a few exceptions like Dead Space, Infinity Blade, and Chaos Rings; but if you look at some of the other Square-enix and EA games, and look at publishers like Sega and Capcom, it becomes quite obvious that they really aren't/don't want to try to bring a console experience game mobile. The only games that really shine on the AppStore are indie games. Maybe Nintendo could serve as a publisher to indie developers on the AppStore.

  • http://players.openfeint.com OFErOne (Erwin Ocampo)

    Wow! @Nintendo:twitter should look at how Dungeon Raid (http://dungeonraid.atspace.com/) deepened its gameplay with every update.

    Dungeon Raid went out, people loved it and when it started getting long in the tooth an update went out (Classes) that deepened the gameplay and hooked you more.

    As people maxed out their classes, their third update (Pretzel Hero & Dungeon Sprint) added Challenge Modes.....

    This should be a blueprint for almost EVERY SINGLE GAME IN THE INDUSTRY.

    This way people get the (polished) game 6 months earlier than a traditional dev cycle, and feel like they're getting their FULL value with value-adding updates!

    My two cents...or 99 cents....errr... $2.99 if we're talking about Dungeon Raid.  :)

  • HelperMonkey

    For a long time now, sales of Nintendo's hardware have been totally driven by - and dependent on - their exclusive first-party software.
    The moment they begin licensing those first-party games to anyone will be the moment that the big N will be out of the hardware market.
    It may happen, and I'd love to have access to their line-up on different systems (including iOS platforms).  But as a kid that experienced the home gaming revolution that the NES was, it would be bittersweet to see them become a software-only enterprise.

    • Thom Denick

      And hardware ultimately is where the money is at because of royalties on all titles sold on the console.  Take a look at Sega now compared to just before the Saturn was released.  As long as Nintendo can release successful consoles (undisputed winner of current generation on not just home, but also hand-held consoles), it would be incredibly shortsighted to sell out their own hardware by releasing titles on competitor's hardware.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        Uh... as far as the press is aware, they just dropped the 3DS down to be a no-profit device.  That means the money is in software and licensing fees, not the hardware, until they can sell enough to streamline production of the device and bring it back into profitability.

      • Anonymous

        Hardware is not where the money is at. One of the reasons this console generation has been dragged out so long is the huge loss the MS and Sony took. MS sold the 360 at a loss and to keep the price as low as possible went cheap on the parts leading to the RROD fiasco that ultimately cost them even more than they saved with cheap parts. PS3 only became profitable last year.

        If hardware was where the money is at, we would be seeing more players. HelperMonkey is correct that Nintendo's hardware has been driven by their first party releases. This is the only reason I bought a gamecube. It's the only reason the N64 didn't bomb. Nintendo's software sales have annually outperformed even the number one third party which depending on the year was either EA or Activision.

        Not just on Nintendo platforms, ALL platforms combined making it even more impressive because you need their hardware. I am pretty sure that even during the Gamecube years they were often on top. They will not be this year, first time in a while. The Wii is in 3rd place year-to-date and the DS is waning. The jury is still out on 3DS.

        Sega never made the best games, they were an arcade game company. We all thought they'd dominate when they went multi-platform until we realized that they didn't make the best games.

  • woozawozza

    I'm still waiting for a nintendo phone to come out and blow my iphone away. God, do I ever want nintendo to make a phone.

  • Pretendo

    I love Nintendo's games, but they have been doing some funky, gimmicky hardware lately. I was appalled at the 3DS simply because it didn't feel like a huge leap from where they were already. The 3D screen alone is just not a good selling feature. Would love to see Nintendo try to do something akin to a smart phone. Sony is making that new beefy hand-held but still wasn't afraid to make the Xperia phone, so Nintendo should do the same.

    If they were really slick enough, they could put all their classic games on there as well (and update the gfx for some of them). A Nintendo phone with an already-available store full of Nintendo classics would be pretty nice right off the bat (Super Metroid up-rezed anyone?)

    Also they should approach it in a way to basically out-do Apple's store (which, considering how much software is on there, isn't organized very well). And perhaps they could gate all the shlock so it doesn't end up being an endless sea of throw-away software like the iStore.

  • Bb

    Because everyone and their mother need an Iphone. News to the world: you don't need to be connected 24/7. Try ditching your phone for one week and see how nice the world becomes. If I want to play games, I'll do it at home; Nintendo gets this. Five second games are not my cup of tea... I don't want it to be over as soon as it started. I just don't understand why people need to spend $$$$ on a phone that does everything. Big Brother is just turning everyone into lemmings. Pretty sad that only a few years ago, answering machines were in style. Now if somone is trying to get in touch with me and I don't answer, they go off the deep end. I guess patience died with technology. Sad.

    • mikeg123

      Then why are you even bothering to waste time posting on an iOS game site?  I really don't understand some people.

    • mikeg123

      Then why are you even bothering to waste time posting on an iOS game site?  I really don't understand some people.

    • mikeg123

      Then why are you even bothering to waste time posting on an iOS game site?  I really don't understand some people.

    • Briker Ed

      No it didn't. People still write letters, the old fashioned way. Not as many as few decades ago, but you can't stop evolution (or devolution, depends how you wanna look at it). It's only natural for the society (and within it the technology) to constantly change, for better or worse. I do agree that we're living in a super-fast society where, now more than ever, time IS money. And since free time is a luxury we all individually chose on what we'll spend ours....

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      Do you know where I pull out my phone most often?  In the spaces where previously I would just be staring at a wall otherwise.  When I'm in line at the store behind five people with enough food to feed an army in their carts, playing a few minutes of a game is better than staring at the next cart wishing the cashier would go faster.  When I'm sitting in a restaurant waiting for my meal to come out, I'd just be staring at the other chairs and wishing the food would come out faster if I wasn't restocking Tiny Tower.  If I play for a long period of time, I'm usually at home, but that doesn't mean that the quick distraction games make people into lemmings.

  • Ryan Sinclair

    I don't care about this 'app' mess. Sure, there are a few really impressive games on the iTouch/iPad but I'd never prize my iPod Touch the way I prize my PSP and Nintendo 3DS.

    I don't care what the naysayers think or say because little cellular phone or ipad gaming doesn't have a thing on the quality of a Nintendo handheld and it's games. Forty dollars for Super Mario 3D Land on the 3DS or Dragon's Crown on the Sony PSVita is fine by me especially when you realize the quality and durability of a product like the Nintendo 3DS. 

  • HelperMonkey

    Right. Nowhere in this article was iOS explicitly mentioned as the desired venue or the desired strategy.  
    A much better title for the article would be "Investors Pressure Nintendo to Enter the Smartphone Market."  They mention two possibilities: One was "buying into" the market, which could hypothetically mean acquiring Nokia, for example.  The other was Nintendo creating their own their own entry into the smartphone market.  Either case would mean a new hardware platform for and by Nintendo.  And in that case they hold on to their intellectual property.  Apple gets nothing (except continuing competition).

    • Anonymous

      Nintendo can't afford Nokia. I don't think they could afford any cell phone manufacturer. They'd have to partner and Nokia already partnered with MS. If they created their own entry it would have to be a pretty darn special phone. Apple essentially re-defined the market during the first year or so of iPhone's existence. Nintendo can't compete by copying the status quo. I have a 3DS and we've all seen the Wii U. I just can't see them making a phone.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      Pfft.. oh yeah.. the Google App Marketplace is a real friggin goldmine.. *rolls eyes.

      OBVIOUSLY it means Apple.

  • Ryan Sinclair

    What this article ignores is the diffence of the iOS market and the "hardcore"/dedicated gameing market. No iOS developer can manage to make more than hundreds of milions in profits because their games aren't valued very well. No expensive game can really stand out in iOS ocean because most people with those devices want free or cheap games. Nintendo regularly sees billions in revenue in the "hardcore" market. That difference is astounding. The real reson investors are annoyed is because they think Nintendo can play in both markets (because even if smaller a couple bilion, hundereds of millions is still nothing to laugh at), not abandon the current and honestly more profitable market right now.
    Sorry, but Nintendo doesn't need to start making their games work on other platforms. 

    • http://toucharcade.com Eli Hodapp

      You believe the success of the Wii and the DS are because of the "hardcore" market? Really?

      • Anonymous

        My six year old loves his wii and DS.. he's totally hardcore!
        (not that i don't tear it up on some mario kart myself)

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YYO2NCKWQZ5VMJ4QTY2P7BW2FU bob

        seriously.  This notion that some so-called "hardcore market" is what drives the industry is ludicrous.  I love videogames and have played them since the late seventies.  The games I've played in the past two years I've had an iphone have been some of the most fun, most perfect PORTABLE games I've everplayed.  If I want to play some 40 hour epic I'll do it on my PS3.  The Iphone and games like Fruit Ninja, Mo's Speedrun, Tilt To Live, Silverfish and tons of others is a PERFECT fit for gaming on the go.  And I think we will find over the next few months that the market of gamers like me is much larger than the self-professed "hardcore" crowd...

      • Jcman7

        Yes I would consider the Wii and DS for hardcore gamers. There are definitely games that fit those categories. I have owned a Nintendo console all my life and I consider myself to be a hardcore gamer but I do like casual games too. I mean who doesn't. Us iOS fans should be aware of that (Angry Birds, Cut The Rope, etc..) I agree with Ryan here because he is right you can make a good profit on console games. Developers are putting so much work into a game for it to be sold for $.99 on the AppStore I mean really it's insane. We are lucky as consumers to have that but for them it's not a great payoff unless your game is Infinity Blade. So it might be more worth it for developers to go with Consoles instead of a mobile platform. It's interesting and I will look forward to see what goes on here. My personally, I am going to buy a 3DS soon. I guess its because I love 3D and I love DS so no better fit.

    • Austinriddle87

      Lol Hardcore market.  Every PS3 and Xbox owner would laugh at you for that comment.  Then every PC gamer would laugh at PS3 and Xbox for thinking they are hardcore too.  Nintendo is the plankton in the food chain of hardcore gamers XP

    • http://twitter.com/JaredTA Jared Nelson

      Yep, those old people in the retirement homes playing Wii tennis are totally hardcore.

    • Anonymous

      Changing attitudes will fix this. I know people that think .99 is too much for whatever reason. "Wow, that looks really neat for a phone game. Too bad it's .99. Time for my $7 latte"

      A lot of the cheap stuff is a trick. Like you pay .99 and get a title screen and have to pay to get more via DLC. Either that or freemium or the facebook 'buy gold' model that even Infinity Blade suffers from.

      A $30 DS game makes probably about $15 in actual profit. I wonder how much Square has sold of FF3? It's $16 so they make about $12 in profit plus they sell separate iPad/iPhone versions.

      Convincing the 'core' gamers that the platform is a contender isn't that hard if they actually play the thing. Most 'core' gamers are teenagers with dumb phones. 

  • Asjw

    Why does the article go on about $40 games and not mention Nintendo's eShop? It may not be as cheap or as plentiful (or as well designed) as the app store but they do provide cheaper games as well.

    Besides this is a lot of nonsense. Nintendo have always gone their own way. They were in second place by a huge margin in the PSX/N64 day but still made some of the best games ever during that period. They were in third place behind the PS2 and Xbox and still survived. Why should they buckle now just because of some cheap and or free games on the iphone ?

    • Ryan Sinclair

      @Asjw, man you're good!

    • Ryan Sinclair

      @Asjw, man you're good!

    • Ryan Sinclair

      @Asjw, man you're good!

    • Ryan Sinclair

      @Asjw, man you're good!

    • Ryan Sinclair

      @Asjw, man you're good!

    • Anonymous

      You're forgetting that Gameboy Pocket/Gameboy Color and Gameboy Advance along with Pokemon saved the day during those rough times. Pokemon hit Japan right after Virtual Boy tanked and was considered too Japanese to come over here. It caused a resurgence in Gameboy releases which did make it over here causing more Gameboy Pockets to be sold. Nintendo wisely localized  Pokemon right around the time Gameboy Color came out. Despite the ancient tech, it sold well and had a small library of good games to tide everybody over before the GBA.

      GBP/GBC and Pokemon made up for the N64's 2nd place status and failure in Japan. GBA kept Nintendo profitable during the dark Gamecube period when everybody was calling on them to go software only. They recycled the Gamecube as the motion controlled casual-friendly Wii and popularized touchscreen gaming with the DS. Both were tremendous successes.

      What is happening now is mobile is changing. I own a 3DS and the resolution is an issue, it's slightly lower than PSP and the original iPhone. The 3D effect is meh and has ghosting. The games are mostly PSP-quality with better lighting and textures that don't have dithering like PSP suffers from. SSF4 is a great mobile rendition of SSF4. There is also no reason why a higher priced SSF4 isn't on the iPhone. The iOS version controls well and people would still buy it if it were priced higher.

      At this point, the future doesn't look so great for 3DS, this coming from a huge Nintendo fan. The best game on it is a port of an N64 game. Nintendo once had plans (and patented a concept) for GBC games on cell phone years back. There was even a little rumor that New Super Mario Bros. and Brain Age would come to the iPhone (because of that patent which turned out to be old). If Nintendo loses mobile, they can't fall back on the Wii. The Wii has run it's course. If you go by year-to-date sales it's in last place and there is nothing except Zelda to look forward to. Everybody's skeptical of the Wii-U. Just some DS ports on the app store would be awesome.

  • Anonymous

    Much like the best camera is the one you have with you, the best mobile game device is the one you have with you.

    • Anonymous

      Usually the best camera I have with me is my phone. You're absolutely right though. Even on airplanes I'm reluctant and lazy to bend down to my carry on and get out the PSP/DS in favor of the phone in my pocket.

      • Anonymous

        exactly...the camera you usually have with you ends up being your phone...;)

  • Johnny101

    The upcoming games that are coming out on iOS. Games like Desert Zombie last stand, Warmgun, March of Heroes, Shadowgun which all will have console like graphics and gameplay will be the new direction of hand held or mobile gamers. Until Nintendo can have games like this, their market will decrease. Really what do most people like to play, Mario Bros or a cool FPS combat game?

    • BruteOutlawz

      "Really what do most people like to play, Mario Bros or a cool FPS combat game?"

      Both :)

      I want it all

  • http://www.facebook.com/PinkPurpleFloyd Jon Gregory

    I've read through most of these comments and failed to see the point I was looking for. I think most of us are spoiled by the pricing of the iOS games......for instance the abundance of .99 games. I think in our head we see these as lesser quality games compared to the $30-$40 console games......if it costs more it MUST be better quality. The term 'Mobile Device' also puts preconceived notions in our head that the gaming is sub par.

     I'll tell you something, a LOT of the iOS games can be packaged and put on a shelf right next to the DS games and get the same $40. Don't forget, Nintendo pays a ton in production costs to manufacturer those games, make labels, make boxes and ship all over the world. Hence your inflated pricing. 
    The iOS user has the liberty of sitting right in his/her own house, not worrying about pre-ordering, sold-out titles etc....We get instant satisfaction at an amazing price for excellent quality gaming.

    • Austinriddle87

      Agreed.  Palm Heroes 2 is deeper and longer than any game on the DS.  Also games like Inifinity Blade have better graphics than Nintendo can deliver.  As soon as the App store merges these 2 aspects, companies unwilling to adapt will basically become unwilling to make profit

    • Anonymous

      That's a fact. There is a lot of crap on DS that instantly hits the bargain bin the moment it comes out. They could sell for $10-20 and be weaker than a lot of the .99 games.

      There are great games on the app store, some are .99 all the time or when on sale but some are $5-$10. FF3 is worth that $16 IMHO, it's a port of the DS game with better textures and retina display. I compared them side by side and it was no contest.

      Also, a lot of the .99 games are incomplete. They're essentially freemiums. People wind up paying a lot more than .99

  • Briker Ed

    2$ or 40$, I don't really care if I think the game is worth it. Also, I don't care which system it's on. Again, if I think it's worth it - I'll get it. What I WOULD LIKE, is to be able to play it all on one system. Since this is virtually not possible, I'd still like getting good games made by companies I like, with their own trademarks (in this case Nintendo) on a system I have (iOS/Android/Whatever) that are adapted to that system's abilities and limitations. Just cause the App Store is flooded with a lot of games not even worth mentioning, doesn't mean that Nintendo couldn't come up with something 'amazing'. Heck, I wouldn't mind playing a Wario Ware(esque) game cooked up in Nintendo's kitchen if they can make it work. For all it's worth, Nintendo could come up with a smartphone exclusive line of titles if they wanted a share of the app market. 

    I don't think anyone's saying they should just drop 3DS and their own consoles altogether, but rather want them to consider investing time into developing games for smartphones alongside their 'premium' console titles. 

    • BrainMasta

      Actually your wrong, there is a way to play "all" it is called On live and it is groundbreaking, once it becomes mainstream both Nintendo and Sony will have a choice whether to stay in the past or jump to the future.  Microsoft has already jumped on board and the speed is unbelievable, there is virtually no lag time and you can play PS3, Xbox 360, and pretty much any game you want ;)  Surprisingly it was started as just a view "people playing games" to being able to jump in and play them without a console! which is remarkable.   This my friends is the future of console gaming: Playing Console games without a Console!

      • BrainMasta

        I will also add that I was once a Sony/Nintendo fan boy, but my ds and psp now sit on a shelf and eventually will just be given away or sold, because that is how much i like my itouch not even a iphone, i take it everywhere with me.  I have over 1,000 games and even the free ones are better than even a single ds game i ever purchased.  What you guys fail to mention is how many console quality games are being released that are FREE and require no inapp at all, there are several and new ones come out each week!  All thanks to the wonderful efforts of Black Smith who started the christmas App event which later lead to : Freeappaday.com and this site!  On Live will be the console and ios will capture the casual market pure and simple

  • Johnny101

    Anyone that has played Dead Space, Modern Combat 2, Infinity Blade and now with all the Unity Engine, Unreal Engine games coming up on iOS, knows that Mobile gaming is reaching a whole new level. For the price that you pay for these games, is an unbelievable bargain.

    • BrainMasta

      Right on man, these games have changed the face of phone gaming, I still look back at the blunder of the N-Gage (yea i was one of the fools who purchased this, biggest mistake of a handheld ever WORST GAMES BAR NONE!) and others and seems that 3DS is going to be their shadow unless Nintendo jumps on board and out of their sinking ship, it is a sad day when all the top developers that used to work for Nintendo have jumped out of the sinking ship and up on the mothership "Apple" ;) so yea just think of how successful Capcom, Namco, and several others have been by just introducing just a handle of the classics/updated classics.  I would love to see Megaman Legends 3 on iphone/itouch ;) and of course the big one MEGA MAN UNIVERSE customizable megaman basically possibilities are limitless any boss you could think of you can make and try out the weapon!  Oh and if you love MMOs please try Eenies At War it is Gunbound for the iphone/itouch ;)

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_SGBZOZI67JW2CJDAIBZ2PU7WX4 Jason

    Like I said before... the bottom line speaks. Nintendo's shareholders will fire their current president if necessary, and replace him with someone smart enough to get in on the app store and meet their profit demands.

    I grew up on SNES too, would LOVE Nintendo games on my iPad and iPhone. I'd shell out Nintendo's high price of $40 for Super Mario All Stars for the iOS right now! But I will NEVER buy a Nintendo handheld just for these games (I wouldn't even take one for free, except maybe to resell it). My iPhone and iPad are all I need... Nintendo can either get on board with the app store and make millions or get left in the dust. 

    • BrainMasta

      Same here man, best console ever was and still is NES!  Contra and Super Contra are still my favorites, we have already got a port of the first, waiting on the 2nd and no i will never jailbreak.  I would also love to see a port of ALIEN SYNDROME! Battle Toads, TMNT, and several other fun multiplayer games that set the stage for party games.  River City Ransom would be like a dream come true ;) DO IT DEVELOPERS PLZ

    • BrainMasta

      Same here man, best console ever was and still is NES!  Contra and Super Contra are still my favorites, we have already got a port of the first, waiting on the 2nd and no i will never jailbreak.  I would also love to see a port of ALIEN SYNDROME! Battle Toads, TMNT, and several other fun multiplayer games that set the stage for party games.  River City Ransom would be like a dream come true ;) DO IT DEVELOPERS PLZ

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      Finally. Talking some sense. And you know what? You're right.
      Just one problem... Nintendo would have to then pay Apple 30% of their revenues. :S

  • Anonymous

    Apple doesn't need their money, nor do they deserve to get 30% of it (all hypothetical).
    I'd MUCH rather see nintendo develop for Sony and Microsoft before they go Apple to be honest. I don't want Apple to be the juggernaut (they already are in a way). That said, nintendo could learn so much from these other companies.

    I know this would never happen, but if Nintendo created a "nintendo phone" (don't post those lame mockups) I would probably jump ship.

    I said this in the 3DS article, but I would prefer a 40$ nintendo game (of my choice) over 40 99c iOS games. Not to say there aren't any amazing iOS games (why would I even be on this site right?) and some are really like console experiences like Phoenix Wright and Ghost Trick, but the lasting inspiration and impression as well as the depth and the story-telling (some games) are so far above iOS games that I need to choose a console/handheld game.

    • Briker Ed

      I could see games with more depth appearing on the app store. I think the main problem is the expandability of the smarthphones, whereas a console you'd want to keep even when outdated. That's one reason (apart from games obviously) why I personally like to get consoles. So I can 'treasure' them and the cartridges/discs/roms long after their life expectancy. Sentiments aside, I still wouldn't mind a few good Nintendo titles either developed or ported from their systems. Something that wouldn't directly compete with the 3DS or whatever they put on the market. I dunno, I can totally see enough room for Nintendo to go completely berzerk with creativity on the general app store (not just iOS), and if they can make online aspects of their games cross-platform, I'd call that pure 'win'.

      • BrainMasta

        Yea just look at how successful 1 Bit Ninja has been, now think of Nintendo jumped in and gave us the port of the original Super Mario for gameboy, still my favorite of all mario games.  However I would consider getting a 3DS if more quality games were added like a new Super Mario Sunshine, but this could easily be put on iphone, because of all the new engines we have at our disposal.  It never ceases to amaze me how we went from Atari graphics literally straight up to N64 and well on past even the top of the console market now, Gears of War used to be groundbreaking and with the current lineup we shall surpass even that, I have no doubt that in the coming months and years ios shall transform the gaming world even more perhaps even surpassing Battle Field 3 which is so lifelike it is unreal!

      • BrainMasta

        Yea just look at how successful 1 Bit Ninja has been, now think of Nintendo jumped in and gave us the port of the original Super Mario for gameboy, still my favorite of all mario games.  However I would consider getting a 3DS if more quality games were added like a new Super Mario Sunshine, but this could easily be put on iphone, because of all the new engines we have at our disposal.  It never ceases to amaze me how we went from Atari graphics literally straight up to N64 and well on past even the top of the console market now, Gears of War used to be groundbreaking and with the current lineup we shall surpass even that, I have no doubt that in the coming months and years ios shall transform the gaming world even more perhaps even surpassing Battle Field 3 which is so lifelike it is unreal!

      • Decoy Octopus

        Your smoking crack if you think ios games carry anywhere near the quality of current gen consoles.

    • Briker Ed

      I could see games with more depth appearing on the app store. I think the main problem is the expandability of the smarthphones, whereas a console you'd want to keep even when outdated. That's one reason (apart from games obviously) why I personally like to get consoles. So I can 'treasure' them and the cartridges/discs/roms long after their life expectancy. Sentiments aside, I still wouldn't mind a few good Nintendo titles either developed or ported from their systems. Something that wouldn't directly compete with the 3DS or whatever they put on the market. I dunno, I can totally see enough room for Nintendo to go completely berzerk with creativity on the general app store (not just iOS), and if they can make online aspects of their games cross-platform, I'd call that pure 'win'.

    • Briker Ed

      I could see games with more depth appearing on the app store. I think the main problem is the expandability of the smarthphones, whereas a console you'd want to keep even when outdated. That's one reason (apart from games obviously) why I personally like to get consoles. So I can 'treasure' them and the cartridges/discs/roms long after their life expectancy. Sentiments aside, I still wouldn't mind a few good Nintendo titles either developed or ported from their systems. Something that wouldn't directly compete with the 3DS or whatever they put on the market. I dunno, I can totally see enough room for Nintendo to go completely berzerk with creativity on the general app store (not just iOS), and if they can make online aspects of their games cross-platform, I'd call that pure 'win'.

    • Briker Ed

      I could see games with more depth appearing on the app store. I think the main problem is the expandability of the smarthphones, whereas a console you'd want to keep even when outdated. That's one reason (apart from games obviously) why I personally like to get consoles. So I can 'treasure' them and the cartridges/discs/roms long after their life expectancy. Sentiments aside, I still wouldn't mind a few good Nintendo titles either developed or ported from their systems. Something that wouldn't directly compete with the 3DS or whatever they put on the market. I dunno, I can totally see enough room for Nintendo to go completely berzerk with creativity on the general app store (not just iOS), and if they can make online aspects of their games cross-platform, I'd call that pure 'win'.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      I love how people are obsessed with that "Apple doesn't deserve 30%" argument.  Have you ever considered exactly how much Nintendo is actually making from a title they sell in Best Buy?  There are layers upon layers of costs and middle men all taking their cut from that $40 box because they had a hand in selling you that game on a physical shelf.  The Apple app store is merely Best Buy in digital form with unlimited space for product.  I would be astounded if Nintendo isn't losing at least 30% of the retail sales price between the retail store's profit margin and packaging alone.  Apple "deserves" their 30% cut on apps just as much for curating and hosting the store as Best Buy does for putting the box on a shelf for someone to pick up and take to the cashier.

      • Anonymous

        That's a good point! I didn't think of it like that. (But I think Best buy makes less than 30%...) That alone won't change anything about my point of view, but thanks for pointing that out.

        I know this sounds weird, but I feel like there's so much quality that comes with Nintendo titles, that taking 30% of them off a DOWNLOADABLE game is a bit over.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        I personally think that the downloadable prices are insanely out of whack in most digital stores right now, precisely because brick & mortar stores like Walmart still have such a hold on pricing determination.  They want their product to still be equally appealing, and thus you pay $50 on Steam for a new game you can buy for $50 in Walmart or Best Buy.  Steam's sales on older games are the ideal world for digital distribution.  Indie developers have said they make a killing on one of those $5 Steam sales, because so many more people will buy something at $5 on a whim than they did on $15-20 (or higher) retail prices.  With no packaging costs and minimal distribution costs, the prices on games SHOULD be lower.  While I agree that the $1 app store bottom out prices are obviously too low, the $5-6 Gameloft and EA new releases have the right idea.

      • Anonymous

        It's not good for my money, but yes, 5+ should be the standard. But humans are greedy and selfish, so it's obvious they would prefer cheaper prices. Honestly, apple kinda screwed game pricing up for the whole industry- and I can't say that's a good thing. That being said, people will download more in general.

        The 3DS eShop games look expensive to me, because they're around 5 dollars, but I keep telling myself to not think in app store terms...but it's difficult.

        We've been spoiled!

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        Well, there's also the question of what kind of app it is.  If it's a cheap clone... maybe that's only worth a dollar.  If it remixes the genre in some new inventive way with a lot of game play and nice graphics, then that may be worth $5.  Geometry Wars when it first came out fits that image for me.  Mega Mall Story (that just came out the other day) is a polished revision of the old Sim Tower style of play.  That is absolutely worth the $4 I spent on it, and I actually had to force myself to put it down after 5 hours or so yesterday.  So while I think the average cost of good games should be a bit higher, there is definitely a reason for some games to be $.99.  The bargain bin has existed in stores long before iOS came around, and for good reason.  Some titles are just junk.

      • Anonymous

        Here's how I look at it.
        As long as there are a ton of (though crappy) 99c apps, people will still demand/want that price. Once a few games start to crawl in the 99c pile that are worth time, then others follow, creating a precedent, which leads to what we have today.
        If it were higher for all, maybe people would be more careful with their money, so those junk apps don't get any attention, and won't get sales, discouraging any crap apps to keep flowing in.

      • BrainMasta

        If you want a hardcore platformer go for MegaNoid or HookChamp both owe their sucess to quality classics such as megaman and old classics of pitfall and caslevania ;)  the apple store is now full of hardcore games that will give you a run for your money, if you want a challenge there are way more then a handful.  I don't consider any game "junk" even the ones that you don't like might be appealing to a child so therefore your logic fails.  "One mans trash is anothers treasure" really applies here!  I provide Stoopid Sanwich as an example, looks like junk but is ironically a well crafted piece of art.  Very innovative and creative in the method of gameplay and way of control.  There is much more to the ios gaming network then just tilt and play as you guys keep saying.  There is the Line drawing genre, tap and slide, bullet dodge, fps, tower defense is a big one, castle defense is also a big one, great source of racing games.   There really isn't a genre of gaming that hasn't been touched on and i believe improved by the ios network.   Some of the most creative games I have played have been in the Apple Store.  To tell you the truth the real reason i even purchased a itouch was by watching my cousin play "Falling Balls" the creative use of the accelerometer blew my mind, it was even better than the wii motion control ;) at the time i hadn't seen how well it worked with racing games or I would have got one so much sooner

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        You misunderstand me.  I am in no way criticizing the plethora of wonderful games that are currently $.99.  In fact, many of them should likely have started out higher priced, even if now they are at bottom bin pricing.

        What I am referring to is the tidal wave of junk that absolutely appears on the app store.  I am talking about broken blatant ripoffs that lack polish or considerable content.  The kind of apps that are there simply because "iOS is where the money is" and not because the developer actually had an idea for a game.  It's the kind of stuff this site doesn't even entertain because it's not worth their time to post a review saying "this was a waste of my money".  It's the kind of game I equate to Carnival Games on the Wii. You likely never notice they're there because they don't even show up on the games section lists they're so bad, yet they keep flooding in, so someone is buying them.  The most that can be hoped is that they're only $.99 so if some poor sap buys one he hasn't lost much when he realizes his mistake.

      • Anonymous

        Best Buy does not make a static % on every product. Their model is different. Best Buy sets their own prices, and they make money on the mark-up. If you want to talk percentages, they make about 2% on a new TV, but they make 50-60% on the cables they sell you.

        The original poster's point and analogy still stand, but I just wanted to clarify the specifics. They make less than 30% on some things, but make an ungodly amount of money from accessories.

      • Anonymous

        Yep. The packaging, the manual, the flash cart, shipping costs, etc. all make a $30 DS game lucky if it makes $15. There is no guarantee that every game manufactured will sell either.

      • BrainMasta

        Not to mention it is because of Apple that we even have the Device/phone in the first place!  If it wasn't for Steve Jobs developing these great technologies then we wouldn't have the means to provide such console quality gaming.  The main reason Apple is doing so well is their support of Indie Developers which are the driving force behind the innovation, if not for them games would be reduced to high score atari like formulas of the past.  Originally there was nothing but high score arcades, now we have genres and sub-genres of gaming which has become a web of networks that extend far into creativity and innovation.  Some of which have become almost works of art like EarthBound, it is so much more then just a game it is a gateway into a realm of creativity that was well beyond it's time.  Some of the greatest games owe their success to the music and ios if full of amazing examples of this.  I still remember when i first downloaded Bit Pilot which soundtrack brings me back to the music of megaman and other great classics ;)

    • Austinriddle87

      You rather have Nintendo develop for Microsoft than Apple because you don't want apple to be a juggernaut.  WTF is Microsoft then!?!?!?!?

      • Anonymous

        Juggernaut in the portable/mobile gaming world.
        Well, they're pretty Juggernaut-ish in general :)

      • Anonymous

        Juggernaut in the portable/mobile gaming world.
        Well, they're pretty Juggernaut-ish in general :)

      • BrainMasta

        Apple has and always will be the underdog of the gaming world, which is where they function best, their method is proven to work and they continually update unlike Microsoft which is full of errors and problems.  Just look at how the Android market has been flooded with scams and viruses, because they haven't locked down their store like Apple has, it is extremely stupid to allow anyone to upload an app without following a set of guidelines and regulations.  If Apple were to allow this then we would have scams like "Free game" then you download and find out you paid 10 bucks, real example of the Android market, or even worse find that they had charged your phone for long distance calls without your knowledge!  Android is just Apple's shadow they might like to act all big and bad but ultimately they fall way short of the quality that the Apple store has to offer, innovation is key in this market and Android has nothing to offer to that.  The only good games Android even has our also on the Apple store so why would you get one?  Vice versa there are several good games like Eenies War WHICH ARE NOT IN THE ANDROID MARKET!  Extremely upsetting to me and my friends, because alot of them have android and can't play

      • Anonymous

        Sorry, but I have to disagree once again.

        First, apple is not the underdog of the gaming world. Even though they never really intended to be this big, Apple is a dominating force and by no means is an underdog. Do you know what underdog means? Here's the definition: 'A competitor thought to have little chance of winning a fight or contest.' How does apple have a small chance of winning the mobile gaming war?

        Second, I have no idea where you pulled Android up, but as an Android user and an iOS user, I'm gonna defend it.

        -Users get scammed and get viruses because they're DUMB. There are extremely innovative and powerful security apps that every android user should be downloading. As a general rule of thumb, anything sketchy, you don't download before research. Same on the computer no? The freedom of android allows for some amazing apps that are only available because of it. BTW, downloading a game for "free" and getting charged 10 bucks does not happen. How bad do you think the Android Market is?

        -Nope, Android is not in Apple's shadow. Their apps are completely different from what we see in the app store. They're utilities, hacks/settings, widgets, powerful music players, root helpers, custom keyboards, launchers, cameras, task killers and more. On the other hand, Apple's is filled with games. (not a bad thing at all cause I love games!). They're for different purposes. Nobody buys an Android device to play games. They use it as a phone. To call, text, browse the internet, check the weather, news, play around with in awkward situations...but people do buy iOS devices to play games. (including myself). It's ridiculous to say that Android has no innovation. You'll get mauled if you say that on an android website :P

        /rant

      • vimy

        i am not sure what you are arguing but i think there are some mistakes.

        apple was the underdog, 10 years ago people were talking about closing shop and becoming another pc maker.they came from no where and thanks to smart marketing and devices became the dominant force although,

        as far as apps go, there is a variety for both android and ios as well as blackberry, widows 7 etc etc, its basically the smartphone vs handheld console debate

      • Anonymous

        Sigh...he said "Apple has and always will be the underdog of the GAMING world". Of course Apple was the underdog in the computer world; it's amazing how far they've come! But I can't exactly say, atm, that they're an underdog of the gaming world...

        I only talked about Android because Brain was bashing it for some reason (thought it's not exactly related to this article or my comment)

      • Anonymous

        Apple is still an underdog in the gaming world. You are confusing their momentum with their current gaming market share. Microsoft and Sony are still way ahead. Apple is winning in the mobile world, but that is not the entire gaming market.

      • Anonymous

        Juggernaut in the portable/mobile gaming world.
        Well, they're pretty Juggernaut-ish in general :)

      • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

        Apple's already bigger than Microsoft. Too late.

    • BrainMasta

      You forgot to mention the amazing console quality of Street Fighter! Thank you so much Capcom for making this and the updated one, i have both and am still having a blast, thanks especially for the multiplayer addition for Street Fighter Volt (99 cents purchase now up to almost 10 bucks, early worm gets the worm =p) Oh and the biggest draw ios has is the updates, they make a game never end!  With each coming update games get better and better, fixing problems and all sorts of customizations and with exception of some are almost always free :)

      • Anonymous

        Sorry, I have to disagree.
        SF:IV is complete crap compared to console and the 3DS versions.
        After playing the SF:IV for the 3DS, I can't go back to the iOS version.
        I just can't :/.
        3DS games get updates too btw, like dead or alive dimensions gets new content every week (costumes I think).

  • Anonymous

    The issue is really this - the portable gaming concept is changing and it's not clear whether or not a non-phone device can survive.

    Nintendo originally released the Game Boy at the peak of their NES era when they effectively had 90% of the console game market. The Game Boy was, for the most part, the first portable game system with interchangeable cartridges that operated on a traditional game development strategy - that is, you could come out with games on it even if you weren't the one who manufactured the unit. Portable gaming didn't exist in that form prior to then, and thanks to Tetris it was a must-have device. It was so successful they manufactured variants of it for over a decade.

    The Game Boy Advance and the Nintendo DS were also wildly successful but less so for their portability and more for their innovative game decisions and the feasibility of development for them. The GBA was essentially a portable SNES, which is why there were so many SNES ports to it and why there were emulators for it before it had even hit the marketplace (some SNES emulator code could be re-used). Consequently it had a wide library of high quality games and also games which would not be acceptable on the consoles of the day. If you had released a game that looked like Metroid Fusion on a traditional console it would have tanked, but it made perfect sense on the GBA.

    The Nintendo DS was able to have innovative gameplay due to the dual screen and touch screen game mechanics. Games like Brain Age, which would have been impossible or impractical on a normal game console, were big hits on the DS. And again, the types of games which thrive on low tech found a home on the DS. The thing was so successful that Dragon Quest 9, which is a bigger deal in Japan than Final Fantasy even, was a DS exclusive. The GTA game on the DS was able to bring back the top-down gameplay styles of the original games, which wouldn't have been feasible on a normal console.

    The problem Nintendo faces is convergence. Back in the early 2000's I carried around two devices - a PDA and a cell phone. It only made logical sense that these two devices would converge, and they did. No one makes PDA's anymore. It's all about cell phones. As an adult I wouldn't carry a DS with me for two reasons. First, it's not a very adult thing to do, but second, the DS is not a small enough device to fit in my pocket. Not even the DS Lite. It's crazy huge and thick compared to, say, the iPhone, and the recent model revisions just make it bigger. 

    A few years back we saw stuff like Personal Trainer: Cooking and that stop smoking game on the DS because there wasn't a single portable platform with enough devices in the marketplace. Thanks to iOS and Android this isn't the case anymore. 

    If Nintendo made the 3DS smaller, like the size of a cell phone, I'm not sure people would want to get it because - it's a second device. It's the PDA along with your cell phone. If Nintendo made a phone of their own I don't think people would buy it because they now have such an investment in iOS and Android apps. And in a feat of irony, Apple now has more cell phone experience than Nintendo, so who knows what problems Nintendo would have before they got it right. And if Nintendo made iOS games then they'd charge more than a buck for them and no one would buy them. Look at how slowly Square games sell, and those are still a fraction of the DS game prices. To say nothing of the feasibility level of spending a ton of money making a game only to have it ignored because the Cut the Rope guy released another dozen-level game. 

    Of course this is all premature speculation. For all we know the investors ask this all the time. The 3DS hasn't seen a Christmas yet so that might help. The biggest game on the system is an old N64 game, we've yet to see if this system has a Pokemon or Nintendogs in it yet. Plus don't forget how many of the DS's players were children - the kind that won't be able to get or have a cell phone and for whom an iPod Touch might not make sense. The price drop this week will probably help a ton. And a whole lot of people - myself included - are holding back to see if the inevitable superior hardware revision thing goes down, like it did with both the DS and GBA. 

    If Nintendo can't hang in the new portable gaming world I don't think it's because they need to get into cell phone games. I think it'll be because the portable gaming market as we know it is gone. The PlayStation Vita will be similarly dead on arrival.

  • Anonymous

    The issue is really this - the portable gaming concept is changing and it's not clear whether or not a non-phone device can survive.

    Nintendo originally released the Game Boy at the peak of their NES era when they effectively had 90% of the console game market. The Game Boy was, for the most part, the first portable game system with interchangeable cartridges that operated on a traditional game development strategy - that is, you could come out with games on it even if you weren't the one who manufactured the unit. Portable gaming didn't exist in that form prior to then, and thanks to Tetris it was a must-have device. It was so successful they manufactured variants of it for over a decade.

    The Game Boy Advance and the Nintendo DS were also wildly successful but less so for their portability and more for their innovative game decisions and the feasibility of development for them. The GBA was essentially a portable SNES, which is why there were so many SNES ports to it and why there were emulators for it before it had even hit the marketplace (some SNES emulator code could be re-used). Consequently it had a wide library of high quality games and also games which would not be acceptable on the consoles of the day. If you had released a game that looked like Metroid Fusion on a traditional console it would have tanked, but it made perfect sense on the GBA.

    The Nintendo DS was able to have innovative gameplay due to the dual screen and touch screen game mechanics. Games like Brain Age, which would have been impossible or impractical on a normal game console, were big hits on the DS. And again, the types of games which thrive on low tech found a home on the DS. The thing was so successful that Dragon Quest 9, which is a bigger deal in Japan than Final Fantasy even, was a DS exclusive. The GTA game on the DS was able to bring back the top-down gameplay styles of the original games, which wouldn't have been feasible on a normal console.

    The problem Nintendo faces is convergence. Back in the early 2000's I carried around two devices - a PDA and a cell phone. It only made logical sense that these two devices would converge, and they did. No one makes PDA's anymore. It's all about cell phones. As an adult I wouldn't carry a DS with me for two reasons. First, it's not a very adult thing to do, but second, the DS is not a small enough device to fit in my pocket. Not even the DS Lite. It's crazy huge and thick compared to, say, the iPhone, and the recent model revisions just make it bigger. 

    A few years back we saw stuff like Personal Trainer: Cooking and that stop smoking game on the DS because there wasn't a single portable platform with enough devices in the marketplace. Thanks to iOS and Android this isn't the case anymore. 

    If Nintendo made the 3DS smaller, like the size of a cell phone, I'm not sure people would want to get it because - it's a second device. It's the PDA along with your cell phone. If Nintendo made a phone of their own I don't think people would buy it because they now have such an investment in iOS and Android apps. And in a feat of irony, Apple now has more cell phone experience than Nintendo, so who knows what problems Nintendo would have before they got it right. And if Nintendo made iOS games then they'd charge more than a buck for them and no one would buy them. Look at how slowly Square games sell, and those are still a fraction of the DS game prices. To say nothing of the feasibility level of spending a ton of money making a game only to have it ignored because the Cut the Rope guy released another dozen-level game. 

    Of course this is all premature speculation. For all we know the investors ask this all the time. The 3DS hasn't seen a Christmas yet so that might help. The biggest game on the system is an old N64 game, we've yet to see if this system has a Pokemon or Nintendogs in it yet. Plus don't forget how many of the DS's players were children - the kind that won't be able to get or have a cell phone and for whom an iPod Touch might not make sense. The price drop this week will probably help a ton. And a whole lot of people - myself included - are holding back to see if the inevitable superior hardware revision thing goes down, like it did with both the DS and GBA. 

    If Nintendo can't hang in the new portable gaming world I don't think it's because they need to get into cell phone games. I think it'll be because the portable gaming market as we know it is gone. The PlayStation Vita will be similarly dead on arrival.

  • Anonymous

    The issue is really this - the portable gaming concept is changing and it's not clear whether or not a non-phone device can survive.

    Nintendo originally released the Game Boy at the peak of their NES era when they effectively had 90% of the console game market. The Game Boy was, for the most part, the first portable game system with interchangeable cartridges that operated on a traditional game development strategy - that is, you could come out with games on it even if you weren't the one who manufactured the unit. Portable gaming didn't exist in that form prior to then, and thanks to Tetris it was a must-have device. It was so successful they manufactured variants of it for over a decade.

    The Game Boy Advance and the Nintendo DS were also wildly successful but less so for their portability and more for their innovative game decisions and the feasibility of development for them. The GBA was essentially a portable SNES, which is why there were so many SNES ports to it and why there were emulators for it before it had even hit the marketplace (some SNES emulator code could be re-used). Consequently it had a wide library of high quality games and also games which would not be acceptable on the consoles of the day. If you had released a game that looked like Metroid Fusion on a traditional console it would have tanked, but it made perfect sense on the GBA.

    The Nintendo DS was able to have innovative gameplay due to the dual screen and touch screen game mechanics. Games like Brain Age, which would have been impossible or impractical on a normal game console, were big hits on the DS. And again, the types of games which thrive on low tech found a home on the DS. The thing was so successful that Dragon Quest 9, which is a bigger deal in Japan than Final Fantasy even, was a DS exclusive. The GTA game on the DS was able to bring back the top-down gameplay styles of the original games, which wouldn't have been feasible on a normal console.

    The problem Nintendo faces is convergence. Back in the early 2000's I carried around two devices - a PDA and a cell phone. It only made logical sense that these two devices would converge, and they did. No one makes PDA's anymore. It's all about cell phones. As an adult I wouldn't carry a DS with me for two reasons. First, it's not a very adult thing to do, but second, the DS is not a small enough device to fit in my pocket. Not even the DS Lite. It's crazy huge and thick compared to, say, the iPhone, and the recent model revisions just make it bigger. 

    A few years back we saw stuff like Personal Trainer: Cooking and that stop smoking game on the DS because there wasn't a single portable platform with enough devices in the marketplace. Thanks to iOS and Android this isn't the case anymore. 

    If Nintendo made the 3DS smaller, like the size of a cell phone, I'm not sure people would want to get it because - it's a second device. It's the PDA along with your cell phone. If Nintendo made a phone of their own I don't think people would buy it because they now have such an investment in iOS and Android apps. And in a feat of irony, Apple now has more cell phone experience than Nintendo, so who knows what problems Nintendo would have before they got it right. And if Nintendo made iOS games then they'd charge more than a buck for them and no one would buy them. Look at how slowly Square games sell, and those are still a fraction of the DS game prices. To say nothing of the feasibility level of spending a ton of money making a game only to have it ignored because the Cut the Rope guy released another dozen-level game. 

    Of course this is all premature speculation. For all we know the investors ask this all the time. The 3DS hasn't seen a Christmas yet so that might help. The biggest game on the system is an old N64 game, we've yet to see if this system has a Pokemon or Nintendogs in it yet. Plus don't forget how many of the DS's players were children - the kind that won't be able to get or have a cell phone and for whom an iPod Touch might not make sense. The price drop this week will probably help a ton. And a whole lot of people - myself included - are holding back to see if the inevitable superior hardware revision thing goes down, like it did with both the DS and GBA. 

    If Nintendo can't hang in the new portable gaming world I don't think it's because they need to get into cell phone games. I think it'll be because the portable gaming market as we know it is gone. The PlayStation Vita will be similarly dead on arrival.

  • Anonymous

    The issue is really this - the portable gaming concept is changing and it's not clear whether or not a non-phone device can survive.

    Nintendo originally released the Game Boy at the peak of their NES era when they effectively had 90% of the console game market. The Game Boy was, for the most part, the first portable game system with interchangeable cartridges that operated on a traditional game development strategy - that is, you could come out with games on it even if you weren't the one who manufactured the unit. Portable gaming didn't exist in that form prior to then, and thanks to Tetris it was a must-have device. It was so successful they manufactured variants of it for over a decade.

    The Game Boy Advance and the Nintendo DS were also wildly successful but less so for their portability and more for their innovative game decisions and the feasibility of development for them. The GBA was essentially a portable SNES, which is why there were so many SNES ports to it and why there were emulators for it before it had even hit the marketplace (some SNES emulator code could be re-used). Consequently it had a wide library of high quality games and also games which would not be acceptable on the consoles of the day. If you had released a game that looked like Metroid Fusion on a traditional console it would have tanked, but it made perfect sense on the GBA.

    The Nintendo DS was able to have innovative gameplay due to the dual screen and touch screen game mechanics. Games like Brain Age, which would have been impossible or impractical on a normal game console, were big hits on the DS. And again, the types of games which thrive on low tech found a home on the DS. The thing was so successful that Dragon Quest 9, which is a bigger deal in Japan than Final Fantasy even, was a DS exclusive. The GTA game on the DS was able to bring back the top-down gameplay styles of the original games, which wouldn't have been feasible on a normal console.

    The problem Nintendo faces is convergence. Back in the early 2000's I carried around two devices - a PDA and a cell phone. It only made logical sense that these two devices would converge, and they did. No one makes PDA's anymore. It's all about cell phones. As an adult I wouldn't carry a DS with me for two reasons. First, it's not a very adult thing to do, but second, the DS is not a small enough device to fit in my pocket. Not even the DS Lite. It's crazy huge and thick compared to, say, the iPhone, and the recent model revisions just make it bigger. 

    A few years back we saw stuff like Personal Trainer: Cooking and that stop smoking game on the DS because there wasn't a single portable platform with enough devices in the marketplace. Thanks to iOS and Android this isn't the case anymore. 

    If Nintendo made the 3DS smaller, like the size of a cell phone, I'm not sure people would want to get it because - it's a second device. It's the PDA along with your cell phone. If Nintendo made a phone of their own I don't think people would buy it because they now have such an investment in iOS and Android apps. And in a feat of irony, Apple now has more cell phone experience than Nintendo, so who knows what problems Nintendo would have before they got it right. And if Nintendo made iOS games then they'd charge more than a buck for them and no one would buy them. Look at how slowly Square games sell, and those are still a fraction of the DS game prices. To say nothing of the feasibility level of spending a ton of money making a game only to have it ignored because the Cut the Rope guy released another dozen-level game. 

    Of course this is all premature speculation. For all we know the investors ask this all the time. The 3DS hasn't seen a Christmas yet so that might help. The biggest game on the system is an old N64 game, we've yet to see if this system has a Pokemon or Nintendogs in it yet. Plus don't forget how many of the DS's players were children - the kind that won't be able to get or have a cell phone and for whom an iPod Touch might not make sense. The price drop this week will probably help a ton. And a whole lot of people - myself included - are holding back to see if the inevitable superior hardware revision thing goes down, like it did with both the DS and GBA. 

    If Nintendo can't hang in the new portable gaming world I don't think it's because they need to get into cell phone games. I think it'll be because the portable gaming market as we know it is gone. The PlayStation Vita will be similarly dead on arrival.

    • BrainMasta

      Great post, couldn't agree more with your thoughts and suggestions ;) if only president of Nintendo felt the way you do, then the company wouldn't be tanking.  The very fact that 3DS doesn't support the old gameboy/ds games is beyond my comprehension, someone obviously didn't think things through at all, this is the very reason why Virtual Boy was a complete flop and yea sadly im one of the fools who bought that as well, however it was only 15 bucks because i got it on sale and the games were a buck each :), got alot of fun out of it mainly because the 3d was revolutionary for the time.  Sure it gave you tunnel vision and mabye screwed up vision due to the black/red but heck it was fun.  I just hope that Nintendo can pull this out, I was excited with the original expectations of the 3DS, but sadly Nintendo failed to wow me with the current ongoing results.  Let's hope they can change his mind.  I am quite sad that the developer of Earthbound decided to stop making games, as are so many fans of Earthbound/Mother series, it was and always will be incomplete due to the lack of the wow factor in the 3rd and final release.  This is just is what is going on with Nintendo, they are becoming outdated just as Earthbound did and without new life and innovation they will fall to the shadows in the gaming industry sadly.  Think if Nintendo just stuck with Mario and decided never to make any other games or allow other developers how successful would the NES been?  The only reason it was a success was the release of Capcom's Megaman, NES was tanking till that release and later the release of Contra!

  • Austinriddle87

    Michael Jackson was amazing in his prime.  Michale Jackson released arguable the best products.  However Michael Jackson started to get some bad reviews, made some poor choices and couldn't adapt with the times.  Even though Michael Jackson's new products were shit, we still clinged on to an era 20 years ago when Michael Jackson was amazing.

    Now replace Michael Jackson with Nintendo, and you get the description of every fan boy here

    • BrainMasta

      Lol, nice summary of the majority of posters, excluding myself.  Don't get me wrong I do still appreciate what Nintendo and other developers did in past, they set a firm foundation for future gaming.  Without them, we wouldn't have the great games we play today!  However Nintendo needs to get with the times, This isn't Japan or China, we don't carry around strange devices, we have phones!  It isn't socially acceptable to just pull out a gameplayer and play in the middle of public, however it is to pull out a phone and text or play a game ;), the people around you can't even tell which you are doing, which is why Experia and Iphone are so popular.  The vast majority of my friends and family have iphones, I know very few who have joined the Andriod market, I see them as on the fringe of the market no matter how much Goggle would like us to believe.  Not sure about the rest of the Country but here in Lousiana Apple is King!

  • Ecco6t9

    Investor's care about tomorrows stock price. If one is smart and savvy enough, you take a slight hit and wait a few months and things turn around.

  • cool guy

    i pity anyone who thinks an iphone is a better gaming platform than a ds...

    • Austinriddle87

      It is, unless we're talking about sitting at home on the couch or in a dark room alone.  When I want to play with my friends, search the net, send a text, and play a sick indie rpg I don't reach for my DS.  Bottom line is, if you're at home use a console, if you're in transit, use a phone. 

    • Austinriddle87

      It is, unless we're talking about sitting at home on the couch or in a dark room alone.  When I want to play with my friends, search the net, send a text, and play a sick indie rpg I don't reach for my DS.  Bottom line is, if you're at home use a console, if you're in transit, use a phone. 

    • Austinriddle87

      It is, unless we're talking about sitting at home on the couch or in a dark room alone.  When I want to play with my friends, search the net, send a text, and play a sick indie rpg I don't reach for my DS.  Bottom line is, if you're at home use a console, if you're in transit, use a phone. 

    • Anonymous

      Since I had my iPad, the desire to play my DS dropped to zero. I still have a shiny black DSi sitting in my draw... just been lazy to get it on eBay. I love the idea of having a much larger variety of choices. Sure there's tons of absolute junk on the ios platform, but, there's tons of excellent games as well.  From week to week, gaming on ios is getting meatier - and I don't miss buttons,  and certainly don't miss holding a stylus at the same time. 

      Anything on a PC that was mouse driven is right at home on the ios platform, especially RTS games, Adventures, RPGs and now, music/rhythm games. Every 3rd party gaming company is jumping on the bandwagon and is taking this platform seriously, so imagine what's in store?

    • Anonymous

      Since I had my iPad, the desire to play my DS dropped to zero. I still have a shiny black DSi sitting in my draw... just been lazy to get it on eBay. I love the idea of having a much larger variety of choices. Sure there's tons of absolute junk on the ios platform, but, there's tons of excellent games as well.  From week to week, gaming on ios is getting meatier - and I don't miss buttons,  and certainly don't miss holding a stylus at the same time. 

      Anything on a PC that was mouse driven is right at home on the ios platform, especially RTS games, Adventures, RPGs and now, music/rhythm games. Every 3rd party gaming company is jumping on the bandwagon and is taking this platform seriously, so imagine what's in store?

    • Vimy

      thats funny cool guy

      so tell me, what are your ten favorite 3ds games
      lol
      too hard to come up with 10 good games,
      how about your top 5

      still too hard.

      would you like my top 50 ios game list.

      there is no comparison 

      • Vimy

        funny thing,k my top 50 probably cost l;ess than your top 5 did.

      • Anonymous

        have you heard of quality over quantity sir?

      • vimy

        yes, thats why i asked for favorite games.
        3ds has quantity, just pour quality

        thats why it is failing, there's nothing worth having on it.

      • Anonymous

        First off, the OP for this comment thread was talking about the DS (much more games, top 10 would be easy). It's obvious that the 3DS doesn't have enough titles, everybody knows that is the top reason as to why it's failing...

        But there are some worth getting. I say that Ocarina of Time, SFIV, Dead or Alive, Ghost Recon, Resident Evil are worth it :). Yes, not much, but was the app store as awesome as it was when it first started?

    • BrainMasta

      Well I pitty the Fool which I believe that you are, your little more then a troll in my opinion.  I doubt you even have a iphone/itouch or you wouldn't make a ridiculous comment such as that.  Not only is it better in gameplay but even more so in innovation and control.  I have never felt the control and ability to put myself into the game as I have on my itouch then any game I have ever played on ds or psp, which says alot of the quality of games compared to the other handhelds!  How can you feel like you are even in control when your just pressing buttons/moving a stick compared to moving with your hands or pinching, drawing, and interacting ON SCREEN, you sir are a sad strange little man and you have my pity goodbye-toystory =p

      • Decoy Octopus

        Your crazy if you think iphone has an overall better quality of games over dedicated gaming handhelds.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YYO2NCKWQZ5VMJ4QTY2P7BW2FU bob

        You're crazy if you think the 3DS isn't going to tank due to the success of the new smartphone gaming platforms.  Sorry, but the times they are a changin. 

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YYO2NCKWQZ5VMJ4QTY2P7BW2FU bob

        You're crazy if you think the 3DS isn't going to tank due to the success of the new smartphone gaming platforms.  Sorry, but the times they are a changin. 

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YYO2NCKWQZ5VMJ4QTY2P7BW2FU bob

        You're crazy if you think the 3DS isn't going to tank due to the success of the new smartphone gaming platforms.  Sorry, but the times they are a changin. 

    • Anonymous

      Grown men shouldn't play DS games in public. :)

  • Vimy

    i am not sure what nintendo expected with the 3ds, its a technology that has no producers understanding how to properly develop, it also has no games.

    releasing nintendo core games to ios, or elsewhere is a bad idea. it would make a quick buck, yes, but it would dilute nintendo's core.

    You see, nintendo, (just like apple in 1994) has a ton of cash but a hardware product linup no one wants, in this case the 3ds, apple had the powerpc. both examples, the companies had core products which were unique and valued, (Final cut pro etc for apple, the mario stuff for nintendo.)

    nvestors were screaming for apple to drop OS and mov e to windows base, the stock drop to the point that the compay was worth less on paper than it had in cash in the bank.

    Apple did the right thing by holding on to there assets and using there creativity to create a device people wanted , I the IMAC and the rest is history.

    If nintendo allows mario and zelda etc to go to other platforms, it would mean that they would never be able to return to being a hardware company. they are not that desperate yet. they need to build a machine for the future., hell, 5 years ago everyone said they would get there ass kicked by xbox and sony, and they became the top selling console. it aint over for nintendo yet.

    people will make the sega comparison as well, but sega was in serious financial deficit and had no choice but to downsize or close.

    btw, I am not a nintendo fan boy, i hate all things mario and never even saw zelda out5side of a few adds. but irecognize there unique position in the market place. people love em and will buy consoles and handheld etc for them.

    going to 3d was a dumb move because nintendo had the gadget but no killer app to go with it. they should have concentrated there efforts on a better machineand they should have had there lineup ready.

  • http://twitter.com/doomlaser Mark Johns

    Isn't it true that each single first party Nintendo Wii or DS title far outgrosses the lifetime history of the App Store's best performers, like Angry Birds or Smurf's Village?

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      That's probably true for the mainline releases of a half dozen titles, like Mario, Zelda, Mario Kart, and Smash Bros, but that kind of single minded reliance is what has the Wii gathering dust for a large chunk of its owners.  Traditionally Nintendo only puts out one title for each of those franchises each console cycle, and then relies on third-party software to carry it the rest of the distance.  With the Wii, that ended up being really trashy through most of its life, which is why it's tanked so quickly now that all the casual gamers have picked it up and are satisfied with Mario and Wii Sports.  There's no way they can get the same results with the Wii U.  The people they hooked with the controller gimmick just aren't going to be interested in upgrading like the hardcore fans always do.

      • vimy

        that is their business model and it has worked in the past and will again in the future unless they bow to presure and cave in.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        Except that they just went into emergency mode and slashed the price of the 3DS down to being unprofitable.  That is a drastic change from the status quot which was selling hardware without taking a loss, so that even if the software ended up weak, they still made their money.  Now they're banking success on the software alone, which means that third-party licensing has to start recouping their costs alongside the flagship titles.  If signal to noise ratio of quality software ends up the same for the 3DS and Wii U as their predecessors, it could be a very dangerous gamble for them.

      • Relytgninroht

        Nintendo's price-cut for the 3DS wasn't because it wasn't selling well- it was because it wasn't selling as well as Nintendo had predicted. Nintendo was so full of pride and arrogance that they figured it would sell like wildfire, much like the DS and Wii before it. They way overestimated their profit from the 3DS, and figured it would sell two to three times the amount of their competition. They had a bonfire, but what they wanted was a forest fire. 

      • Vimy

        by most accounts, it was more like a lit cigarette than a true fire.

      • Vimy

        they are getting bad advice from stock holders and MBA who panic at the drop of a hat.

        take 2 had the same issue right before, (i mean days before) the release of GTA 4. they were being pushed to sell there company to EA. they held on and made massive profits.

        the real issue, the one we are missing outright, is that a small handfull of profit now or bust businessmen are being permited to panic such a traditionally conservative and well managed company into making bad decisions.

        nintendo has tremendous value in its IP. people love them and will buy them.
        they also have billions of dollars in cash sitting in a bank.
        its time for development of the 3ds and not panic.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        They are getting advice from stockholders who see a platform with hundreds of millions of potential users being ignored right after their company cuts their new flagship mobile device to a non-profitable price point.  The GTA 4 issue I can agree with you on, that unjustified panic prior to release.  The 3DS has already been out and had a price cut in less than half a year from release.  That's the equivalent of putting GTA 4 in the bargain bin after the first week of sales.  It's a show of no-confidence in their system to make such a drastic cut so quickly, and the people who have invested in the company have every right to seriously worry about its future.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        They are getting advice from stockholders who see a platform with hundreds of millions of potential users being ignored right after their company cuts their new flagship mobile device to a non-profitable price point.  The GTA 4 issue I can agree with you on, that unjustified panic prior to release.  The 3DS has already been out and had a price cut in less than half a year from release.  That's the equivalent of putting GTA 4 in the bargain bin after the first week of sales.  It's a show of no-confidence in their system to make such a drastic cut so quickly, and the people who have invested in the company have every right to seriously worry about its future.

      • vimy

        its a panic based decision. it was premature to drop the price point before the first true AAA release. bad advice from people who want profit now rather than long haulers

      • Tim

        It has worked in the past, I agree 100%, but the hand-held market has changed dramaticly over the last 4-5 years. In the time of gameboys a few years back, the thought of phones doing what they can do now was insane. Nintendo is being stubborn, there is a time for that, but now is not that time. I can carry around 200 games, apps for work, schedule, email, movies, videos, music, pictures, and internet all in a small little black iphone. Nintendo will survive, they always do, but they will continue to loose more ground in the hand-held market if they don't go back to the drawing board.  

      • Vimy

        they need a killer app. something that is great and sells and everybody wants that would sell this machine.

        it really got pushed out before the developers had a clue as to what to do with it.
        the rehash games everyone mentions, would do fine on the ds, they didnt need the 3d.

        Nintendo is a conservative company with very valuable IP. they have legit fan boys that will buy the 3ds as soon as they get a proper mario-zelda fix. its premature to0 throw in the towel, especially since new home consoles etc are being made.

        things will pick up once a good, (by good I mean mustr have great) title is released. 

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      It's kind of a strange performance.. since those titles cost like 40-80 bucks, and span about 20-30 years... what are you measuring? 

      Angry Birds? Check out the top grossing list on iTunes.. there are way better games than that.

  • Rgfangmunroe

    Nintendo makes their money. Pokemon alone keeps 'em afloat. They do need
    to change their tune towards third party devs, but they are actually
    trying to do that. So, time will tell. I STILL don't get why we turn so
    much scrutiny on them, though. I mean, Microsoft is effectively shunning
    this whole market, aside from that one phone. They aren't developing
    1st party titles for iOS, that's for sure. And Sony isn't rushing to put
    Uncharted and Resistance on iOS. Why don't they get some of this "behind the times" heat?
    The Wii is hurting now, but overall strategy it is still an open race.
    Wii outsold both systems in droves out the gate, so it really depends on
    how Wii U does that determines if they made the right move in the long
    run. 3DS had a weak launch, but its tools are in place and the price is
    now in DSi territory. So we'll see how the holidays treat them.

    And why is there little mention of Nintendo's online service? I have
    more stuff on iOS, for sure. But the things I get on DSiWare and VC are
    (in my opinion) quality. X-Scape, Starship Defense, Cave Story, Link's
    Awakening, Mario Land, Kirby, Soul of Darkness, Stratego, G.G. Series:
    Dark Spirits, Dr. Mario, Shantae...just to name a few. And Zenonia,
    never got into it until I got a D-Pad. In fact, I'll take Mario Land,
    Cave Story, Shantae, Kirby over any retro-inspired platformer (i.e.
    1-bit Ninja, League of Evil, etc- good games, don't get me wrong) on
    iOS. DSiWare has Plants vs Zombies and Zenonia, and Angry Birds (which
    is on PSP Minis) is supposedly hitting the DS online store soon. I know
    that's a small sampling, but those are three titles you often see
    brought up as must-play influences on i-devices.

    Does Nintendo have work to do and changes to make internally? Sure, the
    glory days are far from them, when they were undisputed kings. Though,
    to be fair, they still somewhat lead the pack in innovation. Say what
    you will, but just look- Nintendo redefines controller input with the
    SNES. Sega releases a six-button controller to compete. Next-gen, Sony
    opts for a successor to the SNES controller, Nintendo introduces an
    analog stick and rumble pack. So, Sony develops the Dual Shock. Skipping
    past the GC, cuz that didn't do a damn thing, but portable we get GBA
    and DS- which spur Sony into developing the PSP. Also, 3 yrs after DS we
    get the iPod touch, embracing the beauty of a touch screen. I won't lay
    Apple's decision all on Nintendo, but I'm sure it was considered. The
    Wii is all about motion controls. Along comes Kinect and Move. 3DS
    debuts, and soon everyone is talking about their future 3D plans. They
    still have impact in the industry. Granted, that's a simplification,
    don't think I'm saying Nintendo alone shapes these things. Just that it
    is a factor and they often push it (it is as fair to say they pushed
    touch screen gaming as it is to say Sony pushed DVD and Blu Ray
    transitions, for example).

  • JoelSixPack

    Lets be honest -- NOBODY knows if "the days of the dedicated portable gaming device [are] numbered," to quote Eli.

    Smartphones and dedicated gaming devices are only beginning to fight it out and we all just have to wait and see what happens. Personally, I have a 4th Gen iPod and a 3DS, and I have plenty of love for both of them because they offer very distinctive experiences. And I'm still more than willing to pay $40 for a portable game if it's a good game with plenty of content and high production value.

    But am I in the majority or the minority? I really don't know and I wouldn't pretend to. However, the one thing I do know is that I find it really ANNOYING when people seem to think they can predict the future of a complex industry with absolute clarity.

    So I'm gonna sit back and play some Cut The Rope and play some Ocarina of Time and see how it all plays out...

  • Kaotikonceptz

    You guys really just don't get it do you. Let me explain it in a simple to understand way.

    The iDevices are accidental gaming machine. Steve Jobs didn't want to get into gaming because the failed attempt with the Pippin. Flashfoward to the iPhone AppStore, casual games enter the market at cheap prices and a crumbling economy gave them the advantage to make a name for themselves. In other words, price points not quality helped usher gaming on the iOS platform.

    Everyone is bitching about $40 this and 40 $1, when in reality it's quality vs. quantity. Casual games are not hard to make. In fact, they have a school that has students submit games to the AppStore. Oh btw, they are all the same. So in their right mind they are worth a dollar, I mean 70¢.

    The only game I play a lot on my iPhone is Zenonia, and even that's unbearable because of the lack of tactile controls. V-Pads are a terrible way to play games. How many times your finger slide off the side of the screen while playing Gangstarr West Coast?

    While I'm no a fanboy, I've owned a bunch of Apple and Nintendo products, I can assure you that everyone posting comments about how Nintendo should do this and should do that should shut the (shut yo mouth) up and start asking why Naughty Dog isn't putting Uncharted on the iPad or Microsoft putting Halo on the AppleTV? Or better, why don't you ask Apple why won't they put OSX on the Wii U? Maybe make an iOS for the Wii U controller?

    Grow up people, get laid and be thankful that competition exist.

    • http://twitter.com/21tigermike Michael A. Robson

      "The iDevices are accidental gaming machine"

      Yeah, and Apple is accidentally the most valuable company in the world.

      • sniPyro

        It's as he said, competition is always a good thing. Nintendo is far from dead, first party titles have yet to happen on the 3DS. As you keep talking crap on Nintendo, its about time you realised people want both in their lives. Some people do want buttons, that doesn't mean we fail to adapt, it means buttons make the games a lot more enjoyable for us. Not of all us enjoy 5 minute games like Angry Birds - I sure don't. You may have problems with carrying more than 1 device in your pocket. That's why when I go to uni I have a small bag and can't tell the difference anyway. If you're working already - about time you realised that Nintendo's target market isn't you (that's certainly not to say working people can't buy their games, they just don't usually have the time to play serious). 

        We all own iOS devices here at TA, we're all interested in BOTH markets. I'd like to see both do well as I happen to play both.
        iOS games satisfy my occasional 5 minute train trips. PSP/DS satisfy my 30min+ journeys. 

        Apple may be the most valuable company in the world, but they're not the only company. Android is fast approaching and eating up a lot of the smartphone market. Plenty of people I know switch to android phones because iOS has remained stoic while Android evolves more rapidly (and not as closed as iOS devices are). 

        Back to topic: is Nintendo going to fail hard? IMO not quite yet.Most people here are iOS fans, it's to be expected we don't get much argument from the other side of the spectrum. I think its far too early to call 3DS dead. PS2 took ages to sell well, but when the games came in, by god did it sell like crazy. I don't think 3DS is going to spring up like that, but I doubt it's going to fail as hard as you keep implying.

        Would I like to see Nintendo release games in iOS? Sure I would, but that kill sales on ALL their platforms, and again I point to the low accepted pricing of iOS games.  

        Chaos Rings is typically (when not on sale) at $15 or so. To be honest I find it quite lackluster and could get a much better Square Enix RPG like Crisis Core on PSP for $30. Do I think it worth the extra $15? Sure I do.

        Different devices suit different people, I wouldn't be so quick to call the 3DS dead just because you personally hate carrying 2 devices or prefer cheap games.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      I can actually answer all of the questions you pose at the end.  Uncharted won't go anywhere because Sony has it locked as a PS3/Vita platform exclusive.  Halo won't go anywhere because similarly, Microsoft has it as a locked XBox exclusive title.  Regardless of what Naughty Dog and whoever is taking the reigns of Halo now want, they are contractually obligated to keep those games on the platforms that funded them.  Gears of War is in the same situation, but wait!  Since they were locked into the XBox on their most visible franchise, Epic designed a new IP that wasn't restricted using the Unreal Engine and released it on the app store.  It's called Infinity Blade and it made them millions.  More companies will almost certainly be joining them as the iOS user base continues to grow and the phones continue to get upgrades in graphics and processing technology.

      As for the operating system on Wii U comments, are you seriously asking why Apple wouldn't put their operating system on another company's gaming console?  You'd have to jailbreak the thing just to install it over Nintendo's OS in the first place, and the controller doesn't even have storage, it's a dumb terminal getting data from the (console) server.

  • Pacificsun0481

    Nintendo is still making a 70.00 profit on the cheaper 3DS.

    I'm a huge iOS proponent and really dig the platform on my iPad 2. I've beta tested Aralon and am active on these forums. I own a 360 as well.

    I enjoy the deeper games like Infinity Blade and Cordy, Dead Space and Modern Combat 2.

    I'm not naive, however, as I've (thanks to iOS) actually purchased my first handheld in years...

    I just bought a 3DS 2 days ago (169) from Walmart and still got the ambassador games :0)

    Nintendo isn't in trouble. They'll turn things around, as the user base will snap up a 3DS at it's new price, and the stocks always sag prior to a new console, as the current one is being phased down (Wii).

    I love TouchArcade and there are some great games a low prices. I'm bored of arcade iOS games saturating the iOS market and I'd actually like charming deeper experiences on iOS - most are just too cheap to pay for these, they're disposable and we won't see more than a few good games a year.

    Hence, my desire for well made Nintendo games again. I want to play them so I bought the platform I needed to do so.

    I'm no fan boy by the way.

    -Pacificsun0481

    • http://twitter.com/michaelklopf Michael Klopf

      They may be not in trouble but they had a loss of hundreds of millions, I don't see this as a great thing for the company. Since the N64, they show a kind of arrogance I don't like and they are only mediocre in designing hardware. 

      I don't think the 3DS will go through the roof with that new price. It's either 40$ games or 1-15$ games and a iPod Touch. My kids would get the cheaper solution.

      Nintendo could live well with selling Mario Kart, Zelda etc. for 6-10$. 200 million iOS devices are out there. I could see a Nintendo game on every second device, that's up to one billion in sales.

      Devs can only charge a higher price on iOS when the games are great. Square Enix tries it out to sell their back catalog for 15$ but the ports are bad.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      I have a very, very hard time believing that the 3DS hardware costs only $100 to produce considering it has (essentially) an extra screen, all the motion sensing additions, higher resolution screens than the DS, and likely upgraded camera and networking components over the DSi, not to mention the faster CPU and RAM.  If they were still in the clear to make a 60% profit on every unit sold despite the price cut, I don't think that would have stayed quiet in the press.  Everyone else believes the device is currently unprofitable at the $170 price point, where are you getting your information?

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

      I have a very, very hard time believing that the 3DS hardware costs only $100 to produce considering it has (essentially) an extra screen, all the motion sensing additions, higher resolution screens than the DS, and likely upgraded camera and networking components over the DSi, not to mention the faster CPU and RAM.  If they were still in the clear to make a 60% profit on every unit sold despite the price cut, I don't think that would have stayed quiet in the press.  Everyone else believes the device is currently unprofitable at the $170 price point, where are you getting your information?

      • Pacificsun0481

        Okay so Iwas off on my $100.00, it's 103.00 to manufacture ^_^

        http://www.itproportal.com/2011/03/29/nintendo-3ds-manufacturing-cost-over-100-per-unit/

        http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2011/03/3ds-manufacturing-cost/

        Nintendo unlike Sony, NEVER takes a loss leading approach. They ALWAYS feasibly try to make profit per system.

        Nintendo, unlike Sony is also just in one industry: Videogames.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        That is not Nintendo making $70 on each console then.  If the parts cost $103 to produce the machine, then you have to also factor in the cost of shipping from the factory to warehouses, from the warehouses to retail distribution, the then finally the retail store's cut of the profit to make it worth selling.  If they're making anything on the device, it's next to nothing at this point.  You can't just say the retail price minus parts is all going to Nintendo.

  • montana payne

    Nintendo excels at making games that kids *must* play; zelda, mario, metroid, pokemon, the value in those brands alone is staggering. Not to mention the total disparity in the games that eastern audiences value and those that western audiences value... In the US we don't even see some of the most amazing games being produced for Nintendo platforms. I wouldn't sell my Nintendo stock yet... of all the game systems I own, not one has exactly what Nintendo offers. There's nothing even close to Donkey Kong Country Returns on iOS... that game is amazingly well done.

    • Anonymous

      There is nothing close to DKCR on any platform. That doesn't mean they can't port it

    • Anonymous

      There is nothing close to DKCR on any platform. That doesn't mean they can't port it

    • Anonymous

      There is nothing close to DKCR on any platform. That doesn't mean they can't port it

  • tanner wiegert

    I'm not for this...I love the 3DS and I hate gaming on Phones (I want F'n Buttons that's bigger than a pimple). if Big N goes and makes a phone I hope they tailor to the gamer i.e. the D pad and good sized buttons. I carry my 3DS with me so when I'm waiting I play it not my Smart phone which all the games suck, when compared.

    or better yet do an update to let the 3DS support Skype and their you go a mobile phone (you'll just need to have Wi-Fi =P)

    • tanner wiegert

      also on another note...did any hear what Nintendo had to say to this?

      well if you haven't then let me sum up. after they've done their research they came up with that it wasn't Smart phones that hurt them its the void of games for the system

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Will-Buckingham/518019273 Will Buckingham

        You're right, because Nintendo said that it wasn't their competition that was hurting their business, it must be true.  I used to work for a grocery store that had managers and owners with this attitude.  Their store was literally across the street from three directly competing stores that sold groceries, and a Walmart that is being remodeled to have a full grocery section by the end of this year.  Not five minutes in either direction are another handful of grocery options.  They boasted that none of them were competition while hemorrhaging anywhere from $25-85k a week.  They made employees lives hell, cutting hours, rearranging displays constantly, firing high paid employees and picking up no-experience minimum wage replacements, blaming anyone else they possibly could, all the while raising prices to try and "fix" the problem.  Not only did the situation not change, it gradually worsened. And despite more than nine months of doing that, they continued to deny that the other stores in the neighborhood were competition. 

        I cannot help but see the parallels between them and Nintendo right now.  It's a stubborn refusal to change their business to meet the current demands of the consumer base that will ultimately be their undoing.  Maybe not this console cycle, after all, they have a lot of cash in the bank to burn through, but eventually their stock holders will get tired of seeing them make excuses and sweeping changes will happen whether they like it or not.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YYO2NCKWQZ5VMJ4QTY2P7BW2FU bob

        Agreed.  The suggestion that IOS and to a much lesser degree Android gaming isn't impacting Nintendo's sales now is laughable.  In fact, its the single biggest factor in the 3DS's lacklustre performance.  The smartphones are directly competing with and taking sales from dedicated gaming devices and doing so in a huge way.  Its that simple. 

      • Anonymous

        When Vita tanks, hopefully more people will realize that it is smart phones. Nintendo has said a couple times now that Apple is a larger threat than Sony or Microsoft.

        Here is another factor - Bad design. Not just aesthetically, but the bottom screen will smudge and eventually scratch the top screen. Get something caught between them and a chunk of plastic will come out. This is not like the DS lite hinge thing, every unit has the issue and it is not fixable. Nintendo used to built handhelds like tanks. Not so with 3DS. It is fragile and made up of weak hardware with only the gimmicky 3D effect going for it. I can't even look at mine without seeing those marks and now I have a smudge on the LCD as if pressure is being applied to it.

      • Anonymous

        When Vita tanks, hopefully more people will realize that it is smart phones. Nintendo has said a couple times now that Apple is a larger threat than Sony or Microsoft.

        Here is another factor - Bad design. Not just aesthetically, but the bottom screen will smudge and eventually scratch the top screen. Get something caught between them and a chunk of plastic will come out. This is not like the DS lite hinge thing, every unit has the issue and it is not fixable. Nintendo used to built handhelds like tanks. Not so with 3DS. It is fragile and made up of weak hardware with only the gimmicky 3D effect going for it. I can't even look at mine without seeing those marks and now I have a smudge on the LCD as if pressure is being applied to it.

      • Anonymous

        When Vita tanks, hopefully more people will realize that it is smart phones. Nintendo has said a couple times now that Apple is a larger threat than Sony or Microsoft.

        Here is another factor - Bad design. Not just aesthetically, but the bottom screen will smudge and eventually scratch the top screen. Get something caught between them and a chunk of plastic will come out. This is not like the DS lite hinge thing, every unit has the issue and it is not fixable. Nintendo used to built handhelds like tanks. Not so with 3DS. It is fragile and made up of weak hardware with only the gimmicky 3D effect going for it. I can't even look at mine without seeing those marks and now I have a smudge on the LCD as if pressure is being applied to it.

  • Zim

    It will be a sad day when Nintendo starts to make cellphone games, and if it happens that Vita and 3DS are the last gaming handhelds by Nintendo and Sony, they will be my last handhelds as well.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_YYO2NCKWQZ5VMJ4QTY2P7BW2FU bob

      lol, no they won't. 

  • Kisame83

    The thing that I don't think some people get is that Nintendo is a 1st-party publisher. Meaning, they have their own hardware. Pushing that hardware as a vehicle to sell their 1st-party IP's is ALWAYS going to be central to their strategy. If it becames an unsustainable business model, they could fall back on software as Sega did, but right now that isn't their goal.As such, we will never see their 1st-party titles (or MS' or Sony's) on iOS. This really shouldn't need explaining, but doing so would cut into their hardware profits. How many people have iPhones, iTouch, iPad, and also Android phones and tablets? They throw Ocarina of Time, Super Mario 3D Land (minus the 3D), Mario Kart 7, etc on the mobile market...they would clean up, software-wise. but they would pretty much shut down their console line in the process. I mean, if my chief interest was Sonic 4, am I going to buy an Xbox for it when I can play it on my iTouch?
    There is something to this, though. The Apple devices are not dedicated gaming machines. They are smartphones and tablet PC's. Like PC's, they have a strong gaming subculture. However, this is still a developing market. Don't believe me? Name the killer app. Not just good or high-selling games. Name the game that sells i-devices on its own. Is anyone sitting around thinking "I NEED Infinity Blade, I'm getting an iPad?" Is Street Fighter IV Volt THE definitive version that people pick up a system for? Don't get me wrong- I love Grokion and 1-bit Ninja. But I wouldn't buy an iPod for them. Metroid, Mario? Those can move hardware units. When 3DS drops Smash Bros and their next Pokemon, it will sell systems in a way no smartphone will from a purely gaming perspective- the draw for these things is multifunctional, and games are a bonus.
    I already know people saving for their Vita based solely on the promise of Uncharted. If Sony put Uncharted on iOS, that would hurt their own interests. The same goes for nintendo.

  • Johnny101

    @Bob, you are correct sir. The reason Nintendo is a declining market is because more and more people are buying iphones and smartphones for gaming. Great quality games for dirt cheap prices. As I mentioned before, the games on iOS are getting better. For people complaining about the lack of real controls. Apple will be coming out with the custom fitting control pad. Personally I'm fine using touch screen ( you do get used to it) 

  • bennehftw

    come on pokemon for the ipod!

  • Kairo

    Android anyone

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=690747678 Paul Johnson

    I'd dearly love Apple to turn around at this point and tell them to bollocks.

    Nintendo's arrogant attitude pisses me right off. We seem to be doing just fine without em. They can shove their 30 year old hackneyed old names right where the sun doesn't shine.

  • Henshin2000

    nintendo is going down REALLY??? 207,000 units in 4 days, apple fanboys are really desperate for pokemon game