I'm surprised at how persistent you are about this issue. The dev explained his reasoning politely and even bothered to mention that he respects other people's Pov. Then several forum goers weigh in in support of not changing the game as it would spoil it somewhat for them. Also the dev hasn't posted out and out spoilers too easily as you are suggesting. They are more like hints as to what to try etc. I know you point to many years of enjoying playing rogues as basis for your opinion being relevant but to compare with the dev and decide you have more experience with the genre than him is presumptious at best and downright rude at worst. You seem to be suggesting that you know better than the games creator which direction the game should take in the future. I'm hoping this was not your intention, but it is how it reads. I am suggesting that your requested changes would ruin the game for a lot of players. I strongly believe that the majority of players would be against these changes. You can see that from the support in the thread for not changing things up. I have seen too many games take a hit for the worst as devs desperately try to cram every user-suggested feature into a game often ruining the games balance for the sake of attempting to please a vocal minority of forum going users. Luckily I believe my protesting against this change is probably entirely unnecessary as the dev obviously has strong views on what he puts out there. Nice to see someone stick by their guns no matter what because the game itself matters to them more than money or trying to please users. Sorry DaviddesJ I get your point but I think that it is way off what the majority of users would want for the game.
FWIW I also don't like the idea of an exploration mode or save points, unless maybe it was something you unlocked after beating the game.
First of all, I didn't have too much in terms of expectations when I downloaded this game, but have already spent way more hours (and money) on it than anything else the past few days. I do wish there would have been an option to purchase all four character pairs for a discount, along with the option to purchase separately. Right now I have two pairs, will see how far I can get with them before moving on. Right now I alternate between the Valkyrie and the White Witch. Would love to play around with Beast Mastery some more. I notice that sometimes blessed scrolls of identify work on 2 or 3 items, and occasionally they identify everything you have. Are there different levels of blessings? In terms of save points, or continuous mode, I can definitely see the appeal, but I stand by Waz's decision against it. I would probably use it, but then it'd be more similar to any other RPG and lose some of its appeal. I played Diablo 2 hardcore for years, it definitely is a different play experience. I compiled a list of information for each class, including stat ranges, starting skills/equipment, available talents, etc, as well. Nothing game-breaking or insighful, mostly things you would find out on your own if you took a few minutes. Too lazy to update the wiki, but I'll upload/post it here if Waz says he doesn't mind. Keep up the good work!
The alignment affects which spellbooks you find as I understand it. Please correct me if I'm wrong someone. If I were you I would dive into a Wizard. The wands are awesome fun imo. You start with Magic Missile wand with 20 charges to help you out of trouble while you beef up and equip your character. Give it a try. I'd be interested to hear how much you enjoy it compared to other classes. Make sure you get Literacy so you can learn spells because the wands run out of charges.
In NetHack, you can literally read the source code and discover exactly how everything in the game works. Yet the game is (or was, in its day) very popular; it hardly seems to be "ruined". That's way, way, way more information than just the things you might figure out by trying a few different things in an experimental mode. Indeed, just reading this forum is going to give you more information about the game than what you would be likely to learn from some experiments. It seems to me a big exaggeration to say that giving people access to such sources of information, that they might choose to use or not, could possibly "ruin" the game. But of course YMMV.
Yeah you got me there. 'ruin' is a vast overstatement. I should have said 'possibly take something away from the game and lessen its impact.' Edit : ok. This game is well in the lead for GOTW. I hope it gets some FPL sometime soon ! (Front Page Love)
How far would the player be allowed to go though? In nethack it was everything except being put in the high score list, which is why I say it's everything but the "achievement". Not my intention at all. And yes, I only started with Epyx Rogue in ~1985 (never in ASCII), and never played Hack. I played umoria, mostly turned to nethack because it was better to develop upon. I totally appreciate your input, if nothing else it helps me crystallize my reasoning. I think people exchange ideas and experiences as part of playing the game. That's very different to the huge lists of detailed and source-code-verified spoilers compiled by anonymous hackers (fun to use that word in all three senses at once!) for nethack. I probably do give too many hints - hard to resist sometimes.
Sheesh Believe it or not, even 'in its day' the vast, VAST majority of people playing it did not know enough about C to go code spelunking and find out secrets. And many of those who did have that knowledge, at least in the early days, probably didn't have immediate access to the source code (because they were playing it on multi-user systems that may or may not even have been connected to the internet, and where the files had been compiled by the operator, who probably did not provide source for the whole band.) Compare to ADOM, which does not have any available spoilers from the author, or any kind of an explore mode, and has a huge following that recently raised over $100k to continue its development after a, what, six year hiatus? And in which people were STILL discovering new subtleties three or four years after the latest update? Methinks you should give up on the 'my nethack dongol is bigger than yours' routine now, you are coming across as much more of a (redacted) than I think you intend to. Just smile and nod and back away, and don't buy the damn game if you need one that has an explore mode.
There's also a big difference between information shared by the playerbase from experience and information obtained directly from the dev and/or source code. Sometimes rumours crop up that the dev refuse to verify and isn't yet confirmed from the source code. These things develop into myths that everyone has great fun exploring(recall, about a decade ago, the many speculations over the weird tome, the Red Rooster Inn and the Scroll of Omnipotence in ADOM...great times). I consider these mysteries one of the more irreplaceable aspects of games like this while they last (or until someone who scanned the source code spills it all). Edit: ninja'd by alang...yeah, what he said too
Yes, this is probably the biggest difference in our preferences. I think there are least three different approaches to this sort of game: 1. figure things out by experiment; 2. exchange information in a community; 3. rely on documentation or "spoilers". What I enjoy most is #1. But, as you've designed it, it's very hard to play this game just by experiment, for one and only one reason: it takes many hours to reach some point in the game where you might want to try something, and most likely the experiment is going to mess up that game and you'll need to start all over. Get 5-10 hours into the game, and do that 10 or 20 times, and even the hardiest experimenter will lose their enthusiasm. It would be a lot different in a game that only takes an hour. The result is that people have to depend a lot on spoilers from other players (which to me aren't much different from consulting spoilers on a website, or just reading the code), and/or they never discover a lot of the cool things in the game because it's just not practical to do so. Again, solely because it takes so long to get to that point. (There are things that you can discover by experiment by starting a new game and doing them at the beginning, before restarting, and so those things aren't really at issue.) It's clear that some people really love the "community figuring things out together" aspect. Personally, it's not what I enjoy, but everyone is entitled to their opinion. I do think that, particularly in the App Store world, more and more people are playing the game just because they saw it and it looked like fun and they want to enjoy it on their own and don't necessarily want to be part of some "team effort". That was probably less true in the heyday of games like NetHack where people got into the game through the community in the first place. But, even then, obviously there was a real demand for features like discovery mode (not to mention that most people would experiment simply by copying save files, which was fairly easy to do). But of course the people who are community-oriented are going to be way overrepresented in forums like this one. I think my opinion is worth as much or as little as anyone else's. Maybe slightly more because, as you said, "It's intended to appeal to people who have an existing passion for or a ready predisposition for roguelikes," and, well, that's me to a T. I know things about Rogue 5.2 that no one else ever came up with, I think. But if people like something different from what I like, more power to them. I just get sick of a few of them saying, "You have to stop saying what you like because it's different from what I like." I appreciate that you haven't gone down that path.
I think you're imagining all of this. I have my preferences and you have yours and why can't they be different? I'm thinking maybe I will just hack the game and make copies of the save data so I can reload. Not that hard on iOS. Problem solved for everyone.
We actually agree with each other. If there was some way to divide the players and give each the best game for them, I would. I merely disagree that a checkbox in Options/Game is the way to do it. If you find another way, Spoiler don't worry, the server already ignores duplicate deaths - you wouldn't be the first to take that non-checkbox path. And again, I value every opinion people offer on the game, and I'm glad you all give them.
Apologies if this has already been asked and answered, I got to a certain depth(500 I believe) and got a message saying it was only playable further in the full version. It's probably right in front of my eyes, but I can't seem to find how to unlock the full version.
Yes, it's right there. When you try to descend below 300 feet, the popup message itself has an IAP button for you to click on.
Unless of course, my inexperience with Apple infrastructure bites again. On Android, some devices are sold in regions where Google doesn't allow app sales from their store (yes, it seems stupid to me too), but I couldn't find any evidence that such cases exist for Apple. It should give an explicit message about the app store not being available if that's the case though. In other news, 1.1.6 is submitted to the store, the big change being the promised fixes to multiplayer support. This version also gets text chat as a new feature - I'll need to push that to other platforms before it will work cross-platform of course. I'm also looking into voice chat (sorry, can't use Game Center for that - it's not supported in the engine and isn't multiplatform either) for a later release, as that's really the best way to play multiplayer.
Awesome news ! I can't wait to have a mess around with the m/player component. Really looking forward to some coop play personally Thanks for the hard work updating the game Waz !
