BH has better controls for a touch screen, and a very innovative skill mix-match-system. I didn't say it is a better game overall than DH4, even if it is, it is definitely not because of timers. Full freemium would have unlocked BH's full potential, there is so much wasted potential in Mika games. People are copying his ideas and releasing freemium versions and end up making way more money than the original, while Mika himself makes indie money (even if it is top of the shelf indie money) and his works can not grow from trees to forests. Even Nintendo is doing it, I would really love Mika to go all out and awaken his true potential: http://toucharcade.com/2015/02/18/nintendo-releases-pokemon-shuffle-their-first-game-with-a-candy-crush-style-lives-system/
Seems like the thread *title* suggests that you're going to make a claim about quality, but the content of your post is actually just talking about how much money the apps make. Yes, freemium makes way more money than premium, pretty much across the board. I don't think anyone disagrees with that claim. However, the claim that freemium games are better than premium ones is a different huge claim that requires a lot of support, starting with what your criteria for "better" even is.
I hate defending him, but that is NOT at all what he has been saying. Unfortunately, neither side is very much interested in nuance, and so what keeps happening with his banner example of CoC is that everyone keeps reducing his arguments to a strawman of "fiscal success proves it's the best". Let's see someone actually address the totality of his arguments for Clash of Clans and sound any more grounded than some of his less successful points. Pretty sure no one will, because it is a losing project. So much easier to reduce his points about CoC to a absurd straw man and claim victory, right? I don't think CoC is particularly outstanding as all games go. It becomes way too repetitive and timer delayed as you move through the progression ladder of base building (played it with a moderate amount of attention for about 18 months before quitting). That said, it is an outstanding asynchronous multiplayer strategy game if you want to / don't mind putting up with the incredibly repetitive game flow (check in, tap to collect resources, check to see if troops finished building, if so, find opponent, attack, queue up new troops, exit, return when troops finished building, rinse, repeat, repeat, repeat ). However, the actual strategy of base building and attacking is very deep. If you were in an active enough Clan to run with the newer Clan vs. Clan wars, even more so. As deep as he implies with some of the comparisons to giants like Starcraft? Debatable, but as deep as any other strategy game on mobile? Much less debatable. Like many highly skill based games, they are just crazy clickfests for most of us where we hope something good comes out of it, but for those who can micromanage deploying units and who know exactly how to exploit the different unit AIs, it is way beyond the amusing time waster the game is for most who play it. Further, what is most callously dismissed in this thread is how amazingly balanced the game is in regards to its freemium design. From the very beginning, the only "necessary" IAP is a one time $5 purchase to get the extra builder. Anything else you spend on the game does nothing but push you further up the development ladder so you can play with others that far up the development ladder. In many ways, spending on the game just makes it harder. And, yet, it is and has been a top grossing game across the globe for ages. Now, those who want to dismiss the game are welcome to keep on insisting that says nothing about its appeal or quality, but you would also be just as weird sounding and out of context as hitmanb quoting Molyneux. The amazing financial success of CoC does not prove it is the best (mobile) game independently, but, in the context of its game design, truly unusual freemium balance, and global success, it is very hard to dismiss the probable truth that Supercell did manage to hit upon the particular elixir of game elements to make a very good game that stands above most other mobile games. It might not be your cup of tea, but that won't magically turn it into a bad game, any more than me not liking Wayward Souls after my umpteenth time trying to get into it because of the rabid praise on the forums means it's a terrible game and all the people cheerleading it and its odd sales model are fools and fanboys.
It's just the title of this post that bothers me... "The best freemium mobile games are simply better than best paid mobile games" According to who? And then there is this big long list of opinions on "premium" games, not facts. The only facts any of this has that holds up is that a few freemium mmo games make a lot of money. Good for them. But nothing stated supports the argument "The best freemium mobile games are simply better than best paid mobile games" unless you take into account that the original poster of this topic is some kind of expert in how you think. If that is the case, then maybe it is fact.
I think this thread would've gone a totally different way if instead of "best" hitmanb would've used the phrase "most popular," "enjoyed by more people," or something like that. I feel like he's made some ultra-valid points which are kind of getting dismissed over arguing what objectively makes something the "best."
I'd have to 100% agree with that. It definitely was/is a thread with great potential. If people transpose that word "best" with "enjoyed by most" or something of that like, even "contextually most suited to mobile", rather than focusing on a semantic or qualitative argument about the nature or definition of "best", it could be a very informative discussion.
Point taken. This is the argument: Infinity Blade series is boring after 1 or 2 play throughs. Opinion. Don't take into account that you only payed $7 and it was worthwhile. Remember, when Star Wars 7 comes out, it will cost more for a two hour movie. Will you pay that to watch it at the theater, or will you wait for it to come on tv so you can watch it for free with commercials? Battleheart Legacy - after a week or two of playing you are done with it. So what. It costed $5 bucks. I got my money's worth. XCOM / GTA: Console games are not meant to be played on mobile devices period. They are designed for extended playing sessions in front of a big screen. The virtual controls suck compared to games made for touch screens like clash of clans. And even with that out of equation, these games have the same problem with you play once, beat it and move on. Did you even play XCOM? So there you have it. I have never spent a dollar for Clash of Clans and I do just fine. It is fun to beat players who have invested more but at the same time, my expectation is I will not compete anywhere near the highest level. Life itself is a freemium game people! Some will be born with more money than you will ever see in your entire life time. To me overcome economical disadvantages is a lot of fun, both in real life and in game. So should I dump HBO?
Exactly, COC is not even my personal favorite game on mobile (that would be Puzzles and Dragons, and recently Heroes Charge), but I have no problem acknowledging it being #1 because of how difficult it is to: 1) Create a truly competitive game that offers a balanced playing field for everyone from 0 dollar spenders like me (I saved up for my third builder over a long period of time, I don't care if someone bought or spent time to get my toolbox) to whales. Enough enjoyment whether you average five minutes a day like I have over the last six months, or five hours a day if you are in a serious clan. 2) Offer enough skills/depths to build a following on a hardcore community like Twitch, millions of strategy articles in dozens of languages. 4) Offer enough technology to put every player in the biggest mobile game ever on one server, anywhere you play, any device you are on, the smooth-as-silk server technology behind a game without boundary like this is simply jaw dropping: http://aws.amazon.com/solutions/case-studies/supercell/ 5) Not just top grossing, but #1 top grossing in 58 countries, major markets like US, UK, Sweden, Korea all in one bag, top 10 in Japan, China as well. Heck I can not remember anything in the last 20 years with the same cross-culture top-grossing dominance! LOL @ the Spice Girls comparison, their success is puny compared to this. COC is the Titanic of mobile games, an objective fan will acknowledge greatness when they see it, even if it is not their personal favorite.
I am honestly getting sick of this thread and sick of this guy.Please delete this thread. We all know that this statement:"freemium games are BETTER than premium games"in terms of gameplay is WRONG. Such freemium models will die soon enough,you know why?Players will simply get bored of it. There are already too many candy crush,clash of clans parodies. Why should I play some shit like "contract killer"when I have gta San Andreas?!
You're missing my point. You're telling me to delete a thread because you personally don't like it? That sort of makes you the problem, not the thread or hitmanb.
Not just me,many other people are getting sick of this thread but they just cannot stop posting on it because currently it's the top thread in the general discussion page. You would simply do us a favor if you'll delete this thread but it is your choice...
The best pointless discussions are simply better than best meaningful discussions FACT: You can just stop posting in this thread FACT: There is nothing forcing you to post in threads that are on the front page of the general discussion section FACT: Getting sick of a thread is not a reason to ask the moderators to delete it
The fact that Touch Arcade posted this thread on front page tells me it still has a chance to be saved. TA's decline in Alexa rank last six months is very concerning in the face of all time high Apple sales. I am sure even within TA staff there are people who want to GREATLY increase coverage of games people actually play (all freemium), and there are staff who, like posters of this thread, sees freemium as witchcraft and wants to burn it on a stake to save their beloved paid games. They are praying for the return of an era that will never come back. Articles on every freemium game can be summed up with "but it has timers and tries to get players to buy stuff, so I am going to drop 2 stars by default". I remember on one of the Hearthstone (not even a popular freemium game on mobile, since it is iPad only) articles, someone complained there were too many Hearthstone articles on TA, and someone from TA staff replied it is because Hearthstone articles gets much more traffic than articles on "other" games. Err duh? If you look at the last six TA reviews, Swap Heroes 2, Auro, Ammo Pigs, Daytona Rush, Adventure Time Game Wizard, and King of Thieves, is that a surprise? Who cares about any of these except people who can be looking at COC, one of the top 10 greatest games, and the single highest revenue game in the entire history of gaming and dismiss it because it has timers?
I've actually pretty aggressively been looking to hire someone who does nothing but write Clash of Clans content, but people who play lots of Clash of Clans and can coherently write about it are few and far between.
It is a gigantic opportunity, you guys can easily host something like TA Clash of Clan tournament and invite top teams globally to participate and write strategy articles off it. Do player interviews etc. A ton of untapped potential there. I googled "COC blog" and didn't find anything that a TA sponsored COC blog would not utterly crush.
How much would it pay? I might be able to convince Mrs. Drelbs into letting me take a 2nd job. (Or have my 6yo play it all day and tell me what's going on so I can write articles... )
