Nitpicking even further, vortexing is when you take advantage of an untechable knockdown by mixing up several attack options that lead to more untechable knockdowns, because the opponent has to guess how to defend (do nothing, block, crossup block, crouching block, dash/backdash, wakeup attack, counter throw) on wakeup. Not every character in SFIV: Volt can do it. It also isn't a vortex unless you can respond the untechable knockdown with another opportunity for an ambiguous untechable knockdown. Akuma is the easiest example-- they named it after him and he has plenty of moves that lead to knockdown on wakeup. Of course, with autoblock on vortexes lose a lot of steam (since doing nothing protects you from any attack that needs to be blocked high, regardless of whether it crosses up). You might as well go with a trap like lariat/jump fierce/spd on wakeup instead. It's more effective in Volt.
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But all uppercuts aren't created equal. It trades with a bunch of characters. And some characters, like Ken are easy to bait using it. If I teleport at the right height and use it, SRKs will whiff and I can punish. With Sagat, spear even knocks him out of his ultra/super. I believe it trades, but it's worlds better than jump punch or jump kick in that situation. But with Cammy I couldn't get anything going. When I tried teleporting and spearing to bait the uppercut, the uppercut still connected. Maybe I'm a little off. Does her uppercut connect more horizontally than Ken, Ryu, etc.?
Yep, I always whiff anti air uppercuts when I play sagat in friendlies, cammys uppercut is really, really good for anti air.
I hope so. I don't care if her vortex doesn't work, I'll use her. Secondary, Yun would still be my primary.
Yes. Akuma's vortex has a few plays that aren't untechable knockdowns (such as safe jump/throw), but it's his threat of having so many knockdown options including many that are untechable that force even top players to guess against their favor.
Yeah at least the knives still have a chance to hit whether its comboed or not. Even from the front its still effective into a combo like Akumas air fireballs. Plus if the match goes fast enough whos going to think to just stand there and auto block?
Well a safe jump would have to be off an untechable knockdown..... I know that you have to get a knockdown for it to be considered a vortex, but im not so sure that is has to be untechable. I think things like yuns ambiguous divekick setups (after hard upkicks for example) and vipers ambiguous burning kicks are still considered a vortex.
Those aren't enough offensive options for it to be a vortex. When Yun is in the air it's either because he's going to dive kick, safe jump or stick out a jump attack-- that's it. In the air, Akuma can threaten with a dive kick, a jump attack, a crossup, his air throw, an air fireball, a tatsu, a crossup tatsu, an EX variation of one of these specials, a safe jump into low attack/combo, a safe jump into throw, or a safe jump into super/ultra. He's in the air and you have to account for all these things, and if you're wrong, you get knocked down and you're in ripe position to have to guess again. A crossup move by itself does not a vortex make. On that note, is it even possible to quick stand or quick rise in Street Fighter IV Volt? On the consoles, if you get knocked down by some attacks, you can quick rise them by pressing two attack buttons or tapping down just as you hit the floor, causing you to wake up and react to an incoming attack much faster than you normally could. It's a big reason characters like Akuma or Ibuki, who are rich with knockdown attacks that can not be quick risen or throw escaped that are considered to have a vortex. I don't think Volt has quick stand.
Anyone up for some VOLT of XBL matches right now? Oh and 0-Felix-0, I think XBOX is more worth it. You do pay yearly, but the connections are generally the best and closer to the physical vs you can get, imo.
Yes we know Akuma has a lot of options in the air or not. However, a solid and basic defense (and equal knowledge of the game mechanics) will allow you to defend yourself well and use your tools intelligently. This is where most people fail to step up in their game, and tend to fall above average. But knowing your opponent's abilities and options helps you limit them and their frequent abuse them. Akuma's low health and stun also attribute as a major weakness, because his mistakes can be some of the most fatal to the match. If you watch enough tournaments, he doesn't come out on top of many. Tokido is, of course, proof of Akuma's skill at best. Vortex, on the other hand, is another trait in itself. Although a lot of it does depend on your tools and usage of them, its not simple special moves being thrown out.
Say man, what do you think of Ibukis standing in Volt? could it be possible coming from a console player?
?? Just press a direction and p or k. And i was talking about not knowing which way to block with viper and yun, yun has some incredibly hard to block divekick setups on consoles, and like you said he can empty jump-throw/low/command grab. Also If you watch any vids of latif, kindevu, wolfkrone, any good viper, youll see that they land flame kicks on the best players in the world all the time after a knockdown. Ibuki and akuma are the main two vortex characters but alot of other characters can vortex too. Cammy, dee jay, the twins, rufus,viper, ken etc. all have setups where it can be hard to know how to block. Cammy, the twins and rufus have crossups or fake crossups with divekicks (or crossups with divekicks), viper has burning kicks, ken has his ambiguous crossups and his crosup tatsu and dee jay has one of the best crossups in the game and his d+lk. Im pretty sure they and other characters can vortex, not as well as ibuki and akuma, but they still can.
If someone asked me this questions before Akuma, I'd say I don't know how Capcom could fit all these moves in the controls. But since Akuma came out and can be used adequately, I've so far been impressed how well they can manage all their essential moves in the game on a phone with 4 buttons and a directional pad. So I think they could squeeze Ibuki in if they were to set in motion to do so. I think her controls would be quite similar to Akuma's as well, but of course they couldn't put every single ability of hers in. For example, they'd have to cut out her odd half circle flip/crossup (thats hella slow). That one thats kinda like Chun's flip over crossup attack that is actually in Volt. It's fairly useless and usually only comes out accidentally from most Pro's or average user. But yea, it'd be awesome to see her on Volt. I do agree that Adon would be amazingly fun to play too. Fei is fantastic in Volt as well, I was surprised how much I liked him on the iphone.
