Haha, great matches bro! Your Fei was unstoppable so I had to switch to Zangief and Honda, still you were able to overcome them
Hey, just found this forum/thread. Like the matchup chart posted a few pages back. Although, if any match could be a 8/2 or a 9/1, it's Sagat/Gief. Anyway, my main is Sagat (topped out ~3500bp), I'm learning Fei and I have an ok Dhalsim that I break out every now and then. Oh, and a really crappy Makoto. Gamertag is same as my name here, invite me to some matches!
glad you found the thread, its pretty active. And yea, sagat-geif is a pretty broken matchup. Ill add you on GC, im an Abel player. Im the one who made the chart, just wondering, do you think all of sagats matchups are right? Youve obviously got a fair bit of experience with him if you have 3500 BP (very nice, btw).
Yeah that moves a bitch. You have to block low on startup and high when he comes down. Caught me so many times when I didnt know how to block it. And it does a crapton of chip damage. Luckily theres no way to combo into it
I have real problems with Viper, maybe I don't understand the matchup very well, but it seems like its clearly in her favor. Sagat can't zone her out, which is such a huge part of his game. She can punish near full screen fireballs with ex seismo. And she can change her jump trajectory mid air, so it's tough to connect with tiger uppercut. On the ground, that low kick, thunder knuckle can't be punished on block and you can't neutral jump punish it because it goes under Sagat. One jump kick, tiger uppercut, fadc, forward+roundhouse, ultra is like 75% of her life, but its really tough to hit that. I'd say its 6/4 viper. I think Sagat is 6/4 over Ryu, but I don't have a huge problem with 5/5. He's just better at zoning with the quicker fireball and better anti-air options. The kara tiger uppercut is a big advantage that he has over ryu. He can stand at a range that is outside of ryu's jump kick range, and still punish him - but ryu doesn't want to be there b/c a fireball battle at that distance with sagat is a losing battle. The air tatsu doesn't compensate enough to make it even imo. I've never played a good Sakura, the ones I have played give me the impression that the match is 7/3 Sagat. She has to burn meter just to get in and her rushdown game is just ok. Couple that with low life, and Sagat is a bad matchup for her. Chun Li is a tough one to judge, the only Chun's I've played were pretty good. I honestly think it's either 5/5 or 6/4 in chun's favor, because she's got a great hi low mixup game, amazing throw range and can punish tiger shot on reaction with ultra from near full screen. When she's got ultra, there isn't a range that sagat is comfortable in. Oh, and if you asked me a couple weeks ago, I would have said Vega is so broken and is 7/3 over Sagat. But I finally figured out how to beat that flying barcelona attack. So I got no problem with 6/4 sagat I'll post some more thoughts later.
I had to look that one up - I would get so pissed off b/c i didn't know how to block it. I WAS HOLDING BACK ASFLJSDLKFJKLJAJFDS
That's a good tip, thanks! I always thought you had to block high on the first hit because it goes up in the air. But now that I know this I'll hopefully not be getting hit by too many more of them lol!
I disagree. I'd say it's probably 6/4 in Sagat's favor, maaaaaayyybe even 7/3 but that might be stretching it. Sure she can punish with EX Seismo, but she's gotta build the meter to do it first. And once she does, then what? She doesn't have the HP or the damage to keep up with Sagat. Her normals arent that good and most of her specials are pretty unsafe on block. One bad exchange with Sagat and thats the round for her. Sagat has to respect the Seismo and even EX Thunderknuckle in certain situations, but he can keep her out easily with Tiger shots and a knee/uppercut if she gets too close.
Im gonna jump on for a few matches if anyone wants some of this (and by some of this I mean a few possibly easy wins. I've been playing crappy today lol!)
Damn dude I forgot how good your Guile is, I've wanted to play you since you whooped on me awhile back. Good games Docta!
So with the viper matchup, i almost think youre right. In earlier versions of the tier list I had it as 6-4 viper, but the thing is tiger uppercut>jumping in. But viper can mess up sagats timing with the in air burning kick. Still, tiger uppercut beats burning kick if you time it right. Also seismo trades with tiger shot if used at the same time almost fullscreen, but seismo does more damage, so thats a plus for viper. But on the ground at close range sagat really dominates. Standing hard kick, crouching medium kick and tiger knee just shit on vipers normals. Thats why I put it as 5-5 cos both characters have advantages against eachother, kind of evens out imo, but maybe SLIGHTLY in vipers favour. @the ryu matchup, ill take your word for it, changed in next update. But i didnt know you could kara in volt, i havent been able to kara grab with ken at all, how do you do that? @the chun li matchup, the problem is high tiger shot>everything chun li can do except super and ultra. Her standard approach to fireballs is hazanshu-low kick-EX legs but hazanshu doesnt go over high tiger shots. Also, even if you tiger shot and she jumps at the same time within jumping attack range, you can still tiger uppercut because her jump is so floaty. If she does get in or have an ultra stocked, it becomes interesting because theyre both very strong footsie characters. could be 5-5. Wish we had a chun player on this thread
Tiger uppercut does beat burn kick, but my reads must suck because I whiff a lot. Also, ex thunder knuckle causes a crumple state which can be immediately linked into ultra. I hate that so much. You can't kara throw with ken, but you can kara tiger-anything. Basically its forward+kick followed quickly by whatever tiger move you want. The range on kara tiger uppercut is just insane. I haven't pulled this off in a match yet, but if an opponent is jumping over your fireballs just outside of jump kick range, you can throw a high tiger shot, fadc, kara tiger uppercut and it will connect before your opponent lands - which you can then fadc (assuming you had full meter) into forward-roundhouse into ultra. I saw Sanford do it in a match at the salty suite, i don't remember the opponent. I was floored then and even more floored when it worked in Volt. I'll have to try more high tiger shots vs. hazanshu.
Oh. My. Goodness. That is ridiculous. kara-tigershot-fadc gets you across the screen in a blink. edit: also, if the screen is full zoomed in, and both characters are at the end of the zoomed-in screen, kara-knee can reach + hit. edit2: kick-kara-fadc gets you across the screen even faster and easier than kara-tigershot-fadc.
oh i've had ppl disconnect on me and then game center friend request me with nasty messages b/c they thought i was cheating something like: YOU CHEAT MOTHER��������ER YOUR UPPERCUT COVERS HALF THE ��������ING SCREEN kara tiger knee is real hard to pull off online though, if there is even the slightest input lag, all you get is the roundhouse
I can see how this might have been a glitch that was never fixed. Now I feel like I need to go through every other character looking for kara-potential.
I don't play Sagat but I just jumped into training and that is amazing the Kara SRK is so beastly. Infact it's kinda good alot of people don't know about it or even know what a kara anything is because it would give Sagat an even bigger advantage online.
Yeah man, always a good challenge! I'm going to have to record one of our matches so I can steal a few of your Fei Long moves...
Some googling of sf4 karas (and subsequent testing on volt) shows that Akuma can kara-superdemon from his double roundhouse. There's definitely enough time to react with Ken's SRK after the superdemon flicker, there's even enough time to jump back. But definitely could catch people by surprise. Haven't found much else at the moment.
I've been wanting to play you again too and damn you've gotten good! Those were some frustrating matches for me to be sure. You're the first good Fei player I've played and you stomped me. >_< Expect plenty of invites cuz we gotta do that again! Does it break the game? I'm sure there are plenty of Kara opportunities in the game, but most people probably don't even know about the Kara thing. I wonder if Guile has any. Good games rshkhsee! Sorry I had to peel out, it was getting late and I had to drive home from work. Let's get more in soon! And you too xD4RKSH4DOWSx! I sometimes feel like you go easy on me after you win, and if that's the case, I'd prefer you didn't. It'll make me a better player if I face the "Shin xD4RKSHADOWSx" every time.
