Piracy is getting worse...

Discussion in 'Public Game Developers Forum' started by Psychonaut, Oct 26, 2009.

  1. Harpgliss

    Harpgliss Well-Known Member

    Nov 8, 2009
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    Hi,

    Now you are getting into torrents and a whole nother area that is rather offtopic to whether jail breaking your device is illegal.

    David
     
  2. c0re

    c0re Well-Known Member

    Apr 15, 2009
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    #162 c0re, Nov 19, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2009
    Please do not jump to interpreted conclusions just because I mixed the words Jailbreak and sueing in the same sentence.

    I'm not talking about sueing every jailbreaker, I'm just talking about reporting to Apple jailbreakers who pirated apps.

    That's a huge difference.

    In this case, Apple would do the anti-piracy justice by letting the law do her job to the pirate because he jailbroke AND he enfriged game copyrights. As simple as that.

    Charging is bad, but piracy is worst. Fight fire with fire.

    Although, are you a developer ? I thought we were in a thread created toward developers ...

    It can be cracked only if it is poorly designed.

    Please read all the posts ;)

    Last page, I explained how users wouldn't have to do anything :




    Finally, I though some devs would make some interesting alternative proposals, but well, nevermind.

    Cheers
     
  3. Flickitty

    Flickitty Well-Known Member

    Oct 14, 2009
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    iPhone Dev
    Actually I thought I was on the last page when I quoted and responded to that. I realized my mistake after I submitted, but I decided to leave it unedited.

    It doesn't matter if it is well designed or not, it will still piss off the legitimate user. Inevitably, it will be cracked. Cracking is an art, it is a challenge in the same way that a Puzzle poses a challenge. Games are cracked not because someone want to play that game so badly- they are cracked because it is a personal challenge.

    Financially, does it make sense to spend 48 hours cracking a game when it only costs $0.99? No. I doubt the cracker even plays the game- he has already moved on to the next challenge.
     
  4. Harpgliss

    Harpgliss Well-Known Member

    Nov 8, 2009
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    Hi,

    I am not a developer so I will bow out at this point.

    I will say that I have no issue with reporting pirates to Apple, as long as the information is verifiable.

    The part of my post above that mentioned suing was not directed to you c0re, just a general comment.

    Reason for me posting was the subject of piracy affects customers also and I got interested it the discussion going on.

    Apologies for putting nose where it should not have been.

    David
     
  5. c0re

    c0re Well-Known Member

    Apr 15, 2009
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    No problem David, you are free to participate anywhere I guess.
    Just that the thread derailed too much from anti piracy measures ;)

    Flickitty : I dig that hackers do it for challenge. But honestly, 60 to 90% of piracy is just unbearable if we want to make a living of gamemaking.
     
  6. BlueSolarSoftware

    BlueSolarSoftware Well-Known Member

    Oct 9, 2009
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    iPhone Developer
    Austin
    Here's a novel idea to stop piracy. Why don't you give away your game for free. Then there's nothing to crack, and all the freeloaders and pirates will download a version you can control and update.
     
  7. PixelthisMike

    PixelthisMike Well-Known Member

    Not exactly a novel money-making idea though is it? :p
     
  8. DaveMc99

    DaveMc99 Well-Known Member

    Mar 1, 2009
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    Seattle, WA USA
  9. EssentialParadox

    EssentialParadox Well-Known Member

    Sep 21, 2009
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    I only see one app in there, and that's one of those 'buy credits for clothes for your avatar' games. A model which really only works for a certain type of game, and typically a very young audience too.


    But I think the fact an in-app purchase game (the only real combat against piracy) is doing so well is telling of how widespread piracy is… But also how easily they'll pay for items when they don't have any choice. Of course it's a complete guess to say there are pirates playing that game, but I would bet that's what pushed it so high in the 'grossing' charts.
     
  10. c0re

    c0re Well-Known Member

    Apr 15, 2009
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    Well, I have been spamming posts about piracy for too long now, so I will put an end to it by quoting an outstanding post I saw on Gamasutra :

     
  11. mavis

    mavis Well-Known Member

    What does that mean, exactly? People who pirate games aren't "real" players? In what way are they fake? :confused:
     
  12. c0re

    c0re Well-Known Member

    Apr 15, 2009
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    In some way, pirates can so easily have any games, they so much don't have this "deservation" feeling that a regular can have by giving his money, that they have more chances to not really care about scoring, or giving high performance over time.

    Basically, they want to play the game for an average amount of time, and then go on the next one.

    So they will much less imply themselves in a unique game over time.
     
  13. EssentialParadox

    EssentialParadox Well-Known Member

    Sep 21, 2009
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    Another reason they shouldn't get listed alongside genuine players is because it's possible for the illegal copies to have 'cheating' modifications, artificially making their score higher.
     
  14. micah

    micah Well-Known Member

    Aug 24, 2009
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    San Francisco
    Jailbreaking an iPhone is not illegal. It breaks apple's terms of service. There's a huge difference between breaking a TOS and breaking the law. That's like saying it's illegal to make a gmail account with a fake name. Google might not approve, but it's in absolutely no way illegal.

    Quoting the EFF about this exact topic:

    If you bought an iPhone, you own it. You can do whatever you want with it. It's illegal to pirate software, but it's not illegal to modify software you already bought (e.g. iPhone OS).

    And all this talk about Apple tracking jailbroken UDIDs would just get the jailbreakers to write UDID spoofing software. It's just an arms race that can't be won, and all you can do is be obnoxious to legitimate users to prove that they're legitimate (e.g. Windows Genuine Advantage, anyone?). And everyone knows that since Windows Genuine Advantage came out, no one pirates Windows anymore, right?

    As a developer, I know that a lot of people will pirate my games (probably especially my new game that's coming out, teh internets, since I'm planning on pricing it $1.99 and it has lolcats in it). And hopefully a lot of people will buy it, so I can make my living off of it. But I'm not going to waste my time with DRM or make users login to my server to play to prove that they're legit or anything. It's a losing battle, and against something that I honestly don't think is much of a threat. If there's lots of word-of-mouth that my game is fun (even amongst the pirates), I think that will likely improve my sales.
     
  15. FTomato

    FTomato Member

    Sep 8, 2009
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    Already done, actually.
     
  16. EssentialParadox

    EssentialParadox Well-Known Member

    Sep 21, 2009
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    I think the EFF analogy is good, but doesn't apply to devices where their modification can affect a shared phone network. I think people should be free to hack/jailbreak their devices, but in the understanding that they are giving up their ability to use it over the networks. Because it could affect the service of other customers, either in bandwidth hogging, by someone who installs P2P software; someone who could be hacking an app to use the developers network to their advantage (i.e. cheating); or as we've recently seen, where jailbroken iPhones can be more vulnerable to being hacked.

    These are the reasons why Microsoft banned modified Xbox Live accounts from using their network, and I don't think there would be anything wrong in doing the same with modded iPhones on a network. This way, the networks aren't abused, but the jailbreakers are happy too, as they get to tweak and tinker with their phone and do what they want in private.
     
  17. Mastersoft

    Mastersoft Well-Known Member

    Apr 27, 2009
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    My apps appear on the piracy sites before they even show up as new in the App Store. It's a joke. Maybe it's time to pay a few heavies in Russia to have a quiet word.
     
  18. c0re

    c0re Well-Known Member

    Apr 15, 2009
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    #178 c0re, Nov 22, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2009
    This is becoming ridiculous.


    Seriously, you should take your experience as an example to show to Apple.
    Take some screenshots, take some stats, everything that can prove that at this moment, your app has been hacked faster than Apple putting it on a certain country appstore.

    Then mediatize it, make it popular by sending this to several serious gaming sites like Gamasutra (they're often writing articles about appstore piracy).

    So that the world can know how insulting this piracy thing is turning, and Apple to REALLY do something about it.

    The more hacked devs will become popular, the more people will realize the problem.


    P.S : I know this situation has shown in PC gaming / software earlier, but this is still ridiculous.
     
  19. Mastersoft

    Mastersoft Well-Known Member

    Apr 27, 2009
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    Who to contact at Apple? Doi you have any email addresses?
    I had loads of apps planned for iPhone but I only plan to finish off the 2 I am doing because of piracy. $1 apps combined with piracy is a waste of time, money and effort (except of course for a lucky few).
     
  20. c0re

    c0re Well-Known Member

    Apr 15, 2009
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    #180 c0re, Nov 22, 2009
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2009
    First you should mediatize it to review sites like I wrote.

    Try to find a press link in Gamasutra, Pocketgamer, Slide2play, Engadget, and MacRumors for instance.

    Emphasize with other recent articles you found about piracy (you can find links in this very thread), and on the fact that appstore is starting to become ridiculous for indies.

    Then let the buzz do the job to bring it to Apple.

    Maybe this is naive and won't work at all, but at least, you would have tried.
     

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