HDMI out and gaming

Discussion in 'General Game Discussion and Questions' started by killercow, Dec 18, 2012.

  1. september

    september Well-Known Member

    Sep 14, 2012
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    Controls != to feel, control mechanisms have never worried me.
     
  2. psj3809

    psj3809 Moderator

    Jan 13, 2011
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    I've got an Apple TV, love it

    Its weird playing games when youre staring at the tv as i have to keep looking down as my fingers sometimes move past one of the controls on my ipod or ipad

    BUT i'm loving using an external controller (eg 8-bitty) so then its like a true console type experience, can stare at the tv and control the game with the controller (granted doesnt work for all games).
     
  3. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    Got a second Apple TV today. My HDMI cable with built in usb charging cable should be here this week. I like the AppleTV for Airplay, but it's a nice netflix box and viewing stuff from my pc with iTunes is pretty nice.

    I look forward to testing out some games with it.
     
  4. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    Well, my HDMI adapter came in. I didn't realize that the one I ordered was without an HDMI cable... but I ordered a few 15' HDMI cables so it was all good. Nicely my 27" monitor with HDMI input came in this morning. A few minutes of unboxing the monitor and setting it up and plugging in the hdmi cable and the adapter... and ... wow!

    I love the concept of Airplay but the execution of this is pretty amazing.

    I played a little Final Freeway 2R, but in getting used to it on tv I resorted back to may main control method of the steering wheel and gas in the lower right (though I thought tilt would actually be better) and in my second full game on expert I not only topped my own best score (even better than the one score that didn't register to GC) but topped my friends as well. Now I'm 54th in the world for top score/expert mode. I was already 6th in the world on Normal... but this worked out even better than expected.

    I played a little Real Racing for the first time after buying it. I had tried the demo and it seemed good despite the fact that I typically only like Arcade racers and this being more of a sim. Good stuff. It worked perfectly... and I used tilt steering. I gave Skyriders a try but totally didn't do well at it. Maybe because I tried a harder level than I had been playing. Anyway, flipped over to Angry Birds original... and gave that a whirl. Good fun on the big screen. I like to play all the way zoomed out.. now I think I'll be able to do even better than before.

    So all in all... a great purchase.

    My only gripes are as follows:
    1. Having a heavy cable coming out the end of my phone seems like it could get dislodged when setting it down.
    2. I wish audio was controlled through the hdmi link so I could turn it down easier. On a pc monitor this makes a difference maybe more than a tv where a remote is handy. I'll probably wear headphones most of the time anyway.

    ...

    I guess that's really it other than maybe noticing the battery draining quicker... but that's why I got a cable with a charging cable built in. Though for some reason on my pc monitor I can't charge and do hdmi at the same time. Not sure if that's normal or not... but figured it was worth noting. I'll test it out more tonight at home.
     
  5. #65 Connector, Feb 4, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2013
    An Apple TV review.

    http://ipad.about.com/od/iPad_Accessories/fr/Apple-Tv-Review-3rd-Generation.htm

    While I don't have an Apple TV, I have played numerous times at the Apple store and at a friend's house. I love the fact that it is wireless, and that you can go untethered with an ipad. Overall though, you can basically do any feature with hdmi or apple tv, the basic difference is the wireless ability vs quality of signal. Both can play airplay compliant games (even though I wish there was a way to turn off airplay cause on hdmi, mirroring mode has way better resolution than airplay. Airplay games seem to run well both on apple tv and hdmi. Even though airplay games run at a noticeably lower resolution than mirrored games on my new ipad.

    The main difference to me is in mirrored games, which is about 99% of the games out there cause there are only a handful of airplay games. Apple tv has a very slight delay in the output, maybe a split second, but it is noticeable in games. I really do think that this affects you in terms of scores and control. This delay was fairly noticeable to me, if you look at the ipad and tv at the same time, they are not showing the same thing. An airplane could be showing at a 45 degree angle on your ipad, but it will be totally horizontal on the tv on an apple tv. This doesn't happen on hdmi.

    Hdmi however, shows exactly what you see on the screen and the ipad. To me, this is a big deal, I want instantaneous output, not delayed output. Also on mirrored games, there is lag and occasionally stutter on apple tv. This was very apparent at my friends house. While it wasn't as bad as a lagging and caching youtube video, it was very apparent and very irritating. At the apple store, I noticed it for some mirrored games, even though it wasn't as bad as my friends house.

    Also mirrored games on apple tv do not look as high resolution or maybe it is the frames per second being outputed. Hdmi mirrored looks better than hdtv to me, it looks 1080p or even better. Framerates look twice as high on my tv vs my new ipad. Apple tv mirrored to me, looks almost like 480i, doesn't even look close to 720p. Plus framerates like on games like NFS Most Wanted actually look slower on apple tv, on hdmi tv, the framerates look twice as good, and the graphics look much better on hdmi tv than on my new ipad.

    Night, since you have both, maybe you can comment on these mirrored game issues like the sight delay, lagging, or reduced resolution/framerates. But apple tv is nice cause it is wireless, would be nice for videos and stuff. But for game mirroring, I think I would go with hdmi.
     

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  6. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    Lag for airplay games comes in three flavors...

    1. It's so bad I can't play (mainly with very high action games when my network is being taxed with other people in the house). I mainly use this for showing a game off to the kids so they don't have to swarm over my iphone.

    2. It's passable for playing but you have to get in the frame of mind of leading your actions by a split second. Often this is how optimized games would play.

    3. It's flawless and it's amazing that it's working this well. It has happened, mainly with Asphalt 6. But not enough that I use my AppleTV for airplay'ing games.

    HDMI is perfect but I find a few games (so far, it's been one day and stupidly I left my phone at work for the first time... ever) don't work as well. Skyriders so far has been a pain to play over hdmi.

    For everything else lag doesn't really seem to matter with AppleTV. Showing pictures or playing a video or listing to a track or whatever... it just isn't a big deal and I've had it where it was nearly perfectly in sync to out of sync by 1/2 a second or so. Web browsing is pretty much instantaneous. I don't use the iCloud to sync my pictures and video and stuff... but that's mainly because I don't want every picture I take on it. Sometimes I'm in a store and I want to remember what something costs and I'll take a picture of that. Sometimes I take 4 or 5 pictures of my family for one shot... I wouldn't want every one of those streaming to my appletv. Same for game screen shots... like getting my top score in Final Freeway 2R on expert mode :cool:

    Resolution wise, I have no complaints at all. Sometimes it upscales to full screen... sometimes it has bars or a box. But it's close to 16:9 so there's typically little to no distortion if I stretch to full screen.

    As it is though, I LOVE the AppleTV product for what I use it for (Netflix, Podcasts & internet radio, streaming video from itunes on my pc... etc). Yes, I wish it had a USB port and that it played AVI and other formats... but for what it does do, it's pretty great for such a small package. Hopefully one day since this thing has an A5 with one of the cores turned off and 8GB of storage... they'll make a controller for it (or an i device app) and let us download games directly to it. That (IMO) would be the ultimate home apple console.

    I can dream.
     
  7. chris1a

    chris1a Well-Known Member

    Mar 10, 2010
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    "Yes, I wish it had a USB port and that it played AVI and other formats..."
    / nightc1


    I jailbraked mine and slapped XBMC on it which will play any format you trow at it be it videos, pictures or music (and XBMC supports airplay).


    I've found with airplay enabled games the experience being the same as the above post. Some games work surprisingly well while others are just a laggy mess. High quality graphics and sound or not doesn't matter, so I guess it's up to how well optimized the video encoding and network support is. :confused:

    Either way I found playing airplay supported games (and regular) on the big screen doesn't really add anything to the experience when it comes to iOS games, so ill stick to the iPhone/iPad until things changes...in 10 years or so.
     
  8. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    Mine are both 3rd gen... I though that stuff was only available on the first and maybe second gen devices? If it works on 3rd gen, I may look into it.
     
  9. chris1a

    chris1a Well-Known Member

    Mar 10, 2010
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    I'm using a 2nd gen. And I'm pretty sure you can JB an ATV3 too now, although software version might matter(?). Don't quote me on that tho. Anyway google is your best friend as always!
     
  10. #70 Connector, Feb 5, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2013
    How about non airplay games, mirrored games, like Need For Speed Most Wanted and others? Sometimes I don't like Airplay games cause the resolution just seems so low, and I can pretty much force anything in hdmi to go full screen with 5 modes on my tv.

    Airplay games to me look lower than ipad 2 quality, does not look anywhere close to 1080p or ipad retina. In fact, sometimes I wonder if they are 480i, even though I though airplay games were supposed to be 720p. Since NFS Most Wanted is not airplay and is mirrored, it looks so much better on my tv than Airplay supported Asphalt 7. In contrast, mirrored games on hdmi look 1080p, better than hdtv quality, and play rock solid with no slight delay, of lagging.

    However, because Asphalt 7 is airplay supported, it shows my ipad with the track and no screen. So that is why, I would love to have the option of turning off airplay and going mirrored only. I think airplay facts in that weird time delay that apple tv has, and since the resolution is lower with less bandwitch issues, applet tv users would always want to play in airplay game mode, not mirrored mode like us hdmi users would.

    But it is nice to have native full screen effects in airplay like in Beat Hazard, that game plays so well in Airplay mode. Also, Nova 3 looks wonderful in airplay. But a lot of new games like Wild Blood and NFS MW don't support airplay, so I am wondering if developers are going away from it.

    So let us know if your comments for airplay compliant games is the same for mirrored games. Do notice the same slight delay, and little lagging like you do on airplay games? The mirrored games that I saw in the applestore like Temple Run all looked far worse on apple tv vs hdmi. Hdmi makes most of my games look better on my tv vs my new ipad due to the size, contrast, color, and other stuff. I found that apple tv mirrored games actually looked much worse than on my new ipad, actually even worse than on an ipad 2.
     

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  11. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    I was talking in general of all Apps I've tried through my AppleTV. Only a few I tried were actual AirPlay optimized.

    Nicely last night I tried my HDMI cable on the big screen (older 42" Visio LCD, max 1080i) and the games I tried were all nearly full height with black bars on the side. Which, to me is good enough. I played some Final Freeway 2R and some Siege Hero. I didn't bother with any of the tv modes. I'm going to try the 27" LED 720p tv upstairs tonight and see how it works. That's where the other AppleTV is going for the moment.

    I've noticed some games look like absolute garbage over HDMI. Yesterday during my lunch break I tried playing a little of the gameloft's Ferrari GT, and on the phone it looks great but on tv it looked like a double resolution ds game or something. I know this is an older game and it uses older techniques (and frankly, I think it is a port of a DS game... right?)... but it looked pretty bad. Yet Final Freeway 2R which uses an old Super-Scalar type graphic effect from the 1980's looks great.

    Anyway, it's nice being able to play games on a bigger screen from time to time.
     
  12. About Skyriders, why is that? I find that it is a great game for hdmi, usually I use the left side for left, right side for right, and use my index finger to jump on my new ipad. Sometimes I use the more virtual joypad like controls. Or one could also play tilt. So I don't think it's the controls for you, is it?

    This game looks absolutely wonderful on hdmi tv as shown in the attached screenshot. The framerates look better on tv, the 3d graphics look better, and it is funner for me to play on the tv.

    Or maybe your version crashes or has some bugs? I've had about 5 games that crash or have bugs with hdmi. Space tripper crashes on me with hdmi, Verticus runs really slow to the point of being unplayeable, and a couple of other games have crashed, even though it has been very few. If you have either of these games let me know if they crash or have bugs. I am using an ipad 3 with ios 6.1.

    But curious what you mean by problems playing skyriders, this game plays pretty well on tv to me. Also, this game, I can play in zoom 4x mode or stretch mode to get full screen with original aspect ratios or stretched for a hallway effect, so it is cool.
     

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  13. Adams Immersive

    Adams Immersive Well-Known Member
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    Love gaming on my cheap Qumi projector! I recommend iCade Core (big stick, but not a big cabinet). But I make do with the regular iCade: it's NOT wired and you don't have to have the iPad sitting in it for it to work.
     
  14. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    It doesn't crash or anything. I haven't had that happen but once (Ferrari GT, and when I restarted and went into the game I still was able to play it). Graphics look great too.

    It's a gameplay thing. I think it's just small screen vs big screen and in that game being able to focus both on the near and far is just too much on a bigger screen vs the small screen. At least for me this is the case.

    Brilliant game though. I have had fun playing it and replaying the first two courses to improve times and get golds and stuff.

    Final Freeway 2R by that token should be an issue for me as well but everything happens within a small window in the center of the screen. So it's a lot easier to play on the big screen than Skyriders where every angle of every surface just about makes a difference in a perfect run of collecting orbs and not.
     
  15. #75 Connector, Feb 6, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2013
    Do you have a lot of zoom modes on your tv or monitor? For Skyriders, I use my zoom 4x mode where I get full screen, but it cuts off the top and bottom a little. This might help with the perspective thing you are talking about. If you look closely at this picture and the previous one, you can see what I mean. This zoom 4x mode might work good for you. I switch from game to game, 5 zoom modes that I have for a better experience. Some maintain aspect ratios, some stretch, some zoom in a lot like for iphone only games, where I get no borders on the top and bottom, only a little on the sides. Otherwise there is no way I could play iphone only games cause of the 2x graphics.

    Also, you do hdmi on an iphone 4s right? Never seen hdmi on an iphone before. Got a lot of questions about that, but I'll wait to confirm what devices you use on hdmi.
     

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  16. ConnectorKiller

    ConnectorKiller Active Member

    Jan 11, 2013
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    That's looking pretty good.
     
  17. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    The questions about resolution, I tried without using any zooming. Just bigger screen on that game to me isn't a plus. But that's me, I just do much better on the small screen. I probably wouldn't enjoy it on an ipad either.

    Yep. iPhone 4S just like is listed on the forums. It's the base model with 16GB of storage. Next year is when I think I can upgrade through work to whatever the current phone on the market is. It's kind of sad the only i device in my house capable of HDMI & Airplay is my 4S, but I like the idea of the 5's wide screen and how that should work perfectly over HDMI.

    What kind of Q's do you have?
     
  18. My Top 5 hdmi tv games as of today

    Catch the ark
    Repulze
    Tabletop racing
    Reckless racing 2
    Beat Hazard

    Take a look at the graphics in Tabletop Racing!!! Wowzers!
     

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  19. nightc1

    nightc1 Well-Known Member

    Oct 19, 2012
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    #79 nightc1, Feb 8, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2013
    "Tabletop racing"? I watched the TA Plays of that one and it looked kind of boring and a bit freemiumish. Yes it looks pretty. But it also looked a bit too cluttered.

    My top 5... Which is silly considering the short time with my HDMI cable... so I'll also use my appletv experiences.

    5. Crazy Taxi
    4. Super Mega Worm
    3. Asphalt 6
    2. Siege Hero
    1. Final Freeway 2R

    It's not for anything technical. Those are just good fun on the small and big screen.
     
  20. Wow, never realized that there was a newer version of Final Freeway out there. So I bought the 2R version today for a buck. While I agree with you that it is much better than the first version and was worth a buck, I dunno if it would even make my top 100 hdmi games, but it is very close to Outrun now.

    I agree with you that Crazy taxi and Asphalts play great on hdmi. I have a Gameloft duo gamer joystick and it is great to play Asphalt 7 with it. It is much easier to control with a joypad. While I enjoy a tilting driving game, my ipad with the hdmi connector get quite heavy.

    Tabletop racing and catch the arc are totally awesome on hdmi. Afterburner is too. How do you like it on tv? I often wonder how much of a difference ipad hdmi and iphone hdmi is. Is there anyway you could do a screenshot of Afterburner on tv?
     

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