Thanks for your responses on Sunstar vs Wraith, I actually didn't think about swapping then in the middle of a run. Now I have way more gold than I used to have. Different question though, how do I get Hell Stones? I managed to get to Hell 1, Day 1140, but couldn't finish the quests for the stones. Neither did I receive some after reincarnating, I still have 0. This happened on my android phone with the latest patch, updated yesterday. Edit: Nevermind, just found it out now. Did not think that it would only register after reincarnating, thought it would be more dynamic, like with the Rebirth Stones one.
DISCLAIMER: A good portion of what I'm about to post has no hard evidence behind it so feel free to take it all with a grain of salt. I've yet to make much sense of damage values on the Team tab and, if I'm being honest, it's probably best to just ignore them because they do not do a good job of being representative of actual in-battle results. Example: In my current game, my Living Sword's damage is 100 times greater than Mr. Blade's in the Team tab (lol). I will point out (and this seems to be a common misconception I've seen gleaming through previous posts) that most percent-based upgrades seem to be merely a part of a cumulative bonus that is added to a character's base Damage value. Doesn't make sense? Look at this example: (Totally just making up numbers here) Let's say your Nameless had Damage value of 6,000,000,000 which was the result of having a base value of 600,000,000 and a total of +900% (*10.0) coming from bonuses (skills, training room, etc.). You put two points into Basic Training which puts your total bonus at +903%. This is what happens: 600,000,000 * 10.03 = 6,018,000,000 (correct) This is very different from what a lot people seem to think happens, which is: 6,000,000,000 * 1.03 = 6,180,000,000 (incorrect) I'd also like to point out that bonuses from promotions seem to work differently and have a much larger impact. I haven't played around with it much, but it's my current theory that the promotion bonus is applied separately and AFTER everything else. So in our current case, it would look like this if your Nameless had also 20 promotion levels (+20% 'ATK') on top of those 2 points you put into Basic Training: 600,000,000 * 10.03 = 6,018,000,000 6,018,000,000 * 1.2 = 7,221,600,000 As far I know, a character's base Damage value comes primarily from their weapon. While we're on the subject of weapons, percent-based mod upgrades work in the same fashion (Example: +100% Rend will boost a weapon that normally has 30% vsArmor to a total of 60%, not 130%) and seem to be applied BEFORE other bonuses. EDIT: Benholio also did a good job of answering your question while I was being a slow typist.
Thanks guys. Although I think that different classes of damage bonuses must work multiplicatively in some fashion, because there is no other way to get up to the huge numbers?
My previous post agrees with you. Basically, my current thought is: Base damage (weapon w/ enhancements and mods) * Bonus from skills, training room, etc. * Bonus from promotions = total damage Unsure where Research bonuses fall... Again, the values on the Team tab are a little wonky and must take into account variables that are poorly represented during actual battles.
#Damage Calculations I asked the dev one time about the rebirth and ruby store bonuses interacting, and he said: "Each value is multiplied. Upgrading the Ruby Store raises the character's attack power and is independent of the weapon's attack power." So we've got: •weapon damage: + rebirth store, research •character damage: + ruby store character damage, +promotion bonuses, research •skill damage: + hell store, promotion bonuses, research •Main and merc damage: + hell store, research For some hard numbers: Right now I've got a level 1854 skeleton at promo level 0. Weapon has 11,087,820,000 dps (not fully upgraded...I actually don't usually equip skeleton at all to save money w/ enchanting fees) Character dps is 145,292,600,000,000,000 promoted to level 50, his dps is now...exactly the same. So there are other calculations going on. I wonder if promotion % damage is just added onto the ruby store's upgrade. Right now my character damage upgrade is at 1785% in ruby store, so if I promote 50 levels, does that make it 1835% or ~2700%? It seems like 1835% is what happens, otherwise I'd see more shock and awe when promote! But then there is the level 100 and 200 promotions, with 50% damage... So when skeleton gets promoted to level 100, his dps goes to 217,939,000,000,000,000. So, at least we know how that's calculating. So I'm thinking maybe I misread the description, and the promotions are only meaningful every 20...the rest does basically nothing? You'd have to compare level 60 and 79, for example, and in battle...which is tricky because character damage can range a lot from one battle to the next.
I'm pretty confident that the ATK bonuses from promotions matter, it's not just not apparent in the character details. Based on RPG conventions, I suspect ATK works against an enemies DEF to determine how much of your potential damage you can deal to that enemy. You can test it for sure by fighting a long tower battle with only your hero and then again after buying a +ATK bonus from the hell store. Your stated DPS doesn't change, but your practical damage does. Alternatively, try it with 0 and 19 promotion levels. I kinda wish these formulas were documented somewhere, but at the same time it has been kinda fun trying to reverse engineer them.
Finishing up my first endless run now around day 600, don't care to go further. Got like 580 rubies for day 240. It seems like it is the archer bosses that kill you, doing several thousand damage per shot. But you can research +1 defense!! Am I not understanding, is this a joke, or just an incredibly poorly designed feature?
Questions I am currently on END (Day 560) and would like to have some opinions how to proceed. I can inherit 3 weapons; the 3 legendaries candidates are Axe (99.99), Sword (99.99), Monster Weapon (99.93). My current team: Nameless, Wraith, Ogre, Living Sword, Mr. Eye Mods/Inheritance How would you mod the the inheritance weapons ? My current strategy: 2-3xDmg, the rest random but only one of a type. E.g.: Dmg, Dmg, Asp, Crit, Rend, Anti-magic. All on Level 11 with mod efficiency +158 (Eye with Skill 2 Necklace). Should I get more Dmg mods ? Are there mods to prefer or mods to avoid ? Ruby Store Should I work on getting more inheritance weapons ? Or are there other things to recommend in the ruby store ? My main damage dealers are Nameless and Eye and I have a 99.9x weapons for both, so maybe its better to spend the rubies elsewhere. Rebirth Store: I have all 3 features and all Team members (Sunstar, Nameless, Eye, Soul, Blade) unlocked. Also fully unlocked are Critical Rate, Critical Damage, Weapon Mastery Requirement, Daily Enhancements. Other main investes: Dungeon HP Regen (34), Research Power (41), Weapons damage (60), Boss damage (30). Where should I spend the points ? Accessory enhancement 2 Legendary necklaces MK-41 (+10% on Damage, Crit Chance, Crit Damage) and MK-42 (150 Dungeon Health, 5% Evade Chance). The All Skill MK-14 is on 2.2. Several other Epic necks. Is it worth to further enhance the All Skill ? Is 5% Evade a good stat ? Promotion My two main damage dealers are Nameless (+12), Eye (+14). Should I stay on them for promotions ? kind regards in advance for your input
Riverstomp, have you not gotten the +gold and research necklace?? Focus on getting that next run, stop promoting for a bit and crank that necklace asap. Later can buy the class-specific legendary necklace for your main and crank that. I'd buy the auto-skills for grinding before a 4th legacy weapon. With auto-next battle and auto skill select (and to a lesser extent auto sell and auto research) you can grind on normal while watching tv with 1/10th the effort. Auto enchant is good too but expensive.
I'm just now starting to push my way through GOD, so here's my two cents. Mods So far I've been running my weapons with 3 Dmg mods, 2 Crit mods, and 1 Rend/Anti-magic (whichever the weapon is naturally better at) mod. I've heard Reload can also be useful later if someone on your team doesn't have Moment when -Reload mutations get a bit nuts on later difficulties. I avoid attack speed. Ruby Store I prioritized all the Auto features (including the penalty reduction) and then threw some into damage. I don't have any inherited weapons yet, but will likely invest in it soon. If you have been, don't ignore the damage upgrades here. Rebirth Store Finish upgrading your offensive skills (reload, etc.) with the exception of weapon damage (that'll take a while, but don't ignore it completely). The rest will likely come down to personal preference. I will note that I had to put points into the starting level perk before I could survive GOD Day 1. Accessories Obtain and fully upgrade all the achievement-related accessories (especially the +gold/research one). Yes, I think +3 all skills is worth it. Lv.6 Potential helps your mercs max out their better economical skills much faster, and afterwards the extra points in skills like Builder and Blacksmith remain useful. I also think +% evade chance is worth it if not only for the beginning days of new difficulties. Promotions Promote your main damage dealers as you feel comfortable doing so. Don't completely write off Wraith and Ogre/Orc as their damage can also be pretty respectable and cost much less to promote than Nameless and Mr. Eye. Hope this helps!
@CozyMango - two crit mods will eventually push you well over 100% chance to crit especially if you buy crit % chance from the rebirth store (it is pretty cheap). I'm fire specced right now (fire has extra crit damage) and still only run one crit mod because I don't want to have to change it later or have it be wasted. AFAIK there is no benefit to being over 100% chance to crit except for the last stage of tower??
Mutations that reduce crit rate are not uncommon, so I like to have that extra buffer to keep me closer to 100% despite them. Damage from crits is rather significant and I feel that having my rate knocked down to even something like 75% can be quite a loss of potential DPS. Mostly just my personal preference, though.
I've started a guide/faq that will end up being pretty comprehensive, I think. I've made it open for comments but if you want to help edit it, just make a request. I tried out Benholio's suggestion and did endless waves with my main at promo level 19 and promo level 0. I loaded from a cloud save so everything was identical. Promo level 19 I got to wave #56 Promo level 0 I got to wave #45. So clearly the promotions in between increase character damage, I'd assume 1%, but it seems to be effecting an invisible stat, so...can't say for sure.
Excellent guide! Not sure how I helped, but I appreciate the mention. An early-game research route is kind of tricky since prioritizing most of the bank and statue upgrades might not be totally practical without research boosts coming from the accessory and rebirth store. I remember just researching whatever took the least amount of time, which is a valid strategy if you want to get the coveted accessory faster. Thankfully, early-game research choices are a bit less crucial. Mid-game players that may have not opened up inherited weapons yet might want to grab the enhanced stone before tackling the right side of the tree so that they can get an earlier start leveling up their weapons after getting the monetary researches done. After Artifact Weapon, the next best research to tackle would be Mercenary Training followed by the skill-specific ones for relevant characters. And then just clean up the rest of the tree! Hopefully the non-beta Research Plan will allow us to omit certain researches completely and include the repeatables.
About Research Plan, if you edit it, does it save for next time? Because the default choices seem terrible. Maybe it doesn't matter too much when grinding, and it is definitely a blessing not to have to touch the device for tons of levels at a time. Still, might be worth putting in a better sequence every time, even if that is what it takes. Maybe we should list out a reasonable sequence? Unless that is in the guide? I didn't look at the whole guide yet.
Thanks to everyone who put in suggestions for the guide. They were coming in anonymously so I don't know who to credit, but if you'd like cred please just put your name in there as a co-writer. BTW some comments have been moved to other sections in the doc. #Research plan: The game has changed considerably since I started it, so recommendations for normal/hard/insane and end/god difficulties would be great. Just add in comments. I'm wondering about the best ratio of banks to statues...seems about 2:1... UPDATE: Yeah I tested out a few different combinations. Everything points toward twice as many banks as statues. I can't work out for certain with high levels, because somewhere my building cost formula is breaking down. At low levels at least, 2:1 is best...and that's what it's felt like and I had naturally come to anyway.
Little bit of interesting news. If you reincarnate, the elemental dungeon you have active gains more exp than the others. I bought the IAP at around water level 13 and had nature selected on my last rebirth. Else everytime water, I usually run the endless waves on it and then reincarnate instantly.
