Blog Post: Outsourcing For Fun & Profit

Discussion in 'Public Game Developers Forum' started by MindJuice, Sep 15, 2010.

  1. 99c_gamer

    99c_gamer Well-Known Member

    Mar 23, 2009
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    That's some great info you got there especially about the prices. Not bad!
     
  2. RevolvingDoor

    RevolvingDoor Well-Known Member

    Dec 13, 2009
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    Very well-written post! There is a lot of great information here.

    However, I must say that there are a lot of competent freelance artists, coders, and musicians on these very boards (I like to think that I might be one of them.) Before you go to a service like ELance, consider posting a request on TouchArcade. ;)
     
  3. mr.Ugly

    mr.Ugly Well-Known Member

    Dec 1, 2009
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    nice blog post!




    well but one should consider elane & co as big platform where you can actualy choose from a broad quantity of artists with real qualification

    most of the stuff posted on ta is barely amateur. sure there are a few gems here and there but thoose are usualy companies and individuals you will also find on such sites.
     
  4. That's a very good point to bring up. Price is also not the only factor to consider when choosing a provider.

    Although I have found several skilled artists on Elance, creativity and commitment are also important. Those are harder to find on Elance.

    I mentioned him in the article, but I'll point out again, that I found Kip Ayers on Elance.com, and he is an INCREDIBLE illustrator. Definitely check him out if you need fantasy illustration work.
     
  5. smuttlegiaco

    smuttlegiaco Well-Known Member

    Aug 19, 2010
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    Game Designer
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    nice one!

    it's a pleasure to learn and I definitely learned quite a bit from you post. thank you.
     
  6. 99c_gamer

    99c_gamer Well-Known Member

    Mar 23, 2009
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    it's especially useful if you're a pure coder like me.
    I think it's much easier to outsource the art/music than the entire programming job.
     
  7. andrew43

    andrew43 New Member

    Dec 28, 2010
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    Outsourcing for Fun & Profit

    Hi..

    I do have experience as a Freelancer for about + 5 years. I tried almost all of the freelancing portals and have good feed backs on Guru.com, Elance and 99Desk.com.

    After my experience of 5 years, the conclusion is: these website can give you a way to work. Its all upto you how to make money of them.

    But if you wish to earn real money, always direct contact will be fruitful.:)
     
  8. layzerboy

    layzerboy Well-Known Member

    Dec 1, 2010
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    Outer Space
  9. mr.Ugly

    mr.Ugly Well-Known Member

    Dec 1, 2009
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    #10 mr.Ugly, Dec 30, 2010
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2010


    LOL...thats the reason there is this thing called secrecy.. you don't tell anybody about your next super million dollar hit.. that ensures it that all the imaginary money.. stay with you and your imaginary friends..


    at one point people should understand.. that no one fu**ing cares about ideas of others.. especially not in this business..

    its not about ideas its about execution.. what do you think happens? you hire an freelancer then he takes your prescious idea into his dark castle and let his missions do a clone.. and even release it before YOU!...

    that would be horrible.. like the pink elephants flying through the streets right now... i hate them.. they always make fartsy noises..

    ahh wait.. i should have turned on reality.. click.. ahh.. better

    again no one wants to steal your ideas.. they rather steal your money.

    if you hire someone you usualy set up an contract regulation everything in advance..

    and if all hell breaks loose you'll find yourself in court next to your former evil villian you hired.. lets hope he doesnt win the case.. think about all the millions lost... and the poor children who will buy the knockoff version on the appstore.. brr
     
  10. layzerboy

    layzerboy Well-Known Member

    Dec 1, 2010
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    i love you man.. that was a funny reply..

    i get what you are saying but there are people with the means to make things happen with an idea/concept they receive. but what do i know...

     
  11. mr.Ugly

    mr.Ugly Well-Known Member

    Dec 1, 2009
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    believe me there are no such people.. like i said execution is what matters..

    what most people think is a unique idea was done at least a dozen time..

    i havent seen something revolitionarie in ages.. its all slight evolution..

    take a look at angry bird since this is the best example.. there where games before it with identical game mechanics.. and they where many games after angry birds with the same mechanics...

    its not about ideas.. and it never will be.. you find good game ideas as much as there is sand on a beach.. its all about the execution.
     
  12. crazygambit

    crazygambit Well-Known Member

    Nov 15, 2010
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    For once I completely 100% agree with Mr.Ugly. Seriously, no one cares about your ideas. Everyone in the position to biuld those ideas into something, has tons and tons of ideas of their own they don't have time to develop already.

    I would direct you to here, for some thought about game ideas.
     
  13. #14 MindJuice, Dec 30, 2010
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2010
    If someone came to me looking to develop a game with a description like this:
    "Physics simulation where you shoot various types of birds at buildings and structures to try to destroy them. Inside the structures will be round pigs. The goal of each level is to kill the pigs by knocking the structures down on top of them."
    My most likely thought would be "Yeah, I've seen games like that before".

    The logical thing to do would be to get paid for writing the game since it's most likely to slide into obscurity. The chances of any game concept that's been done before hitting it big are quite low, but of course it does happen.

    On the other side of the coin, if your game concept is totally new and unique, chances are that other devs won't really see its potential until it's successful. Who would have really thought that Minecraft would take off like it did?

    Would you rather get paid well and consistently for creating apps for others, or hope that one of your next 10 or so apps hits it big? Chances are you will make more money writing games for others.

    Having said that, I don't currently write games for others as iOS dev is my side hobby. I do industrial automation software in my day job.
     
  14. Nullroar

    Nullroar Well-Known Member

    Jan 6, 2010
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    Software Rep, Rhyme Guru, Game Editor
    Munich
    #15 Nullroar, Dec 31, 2010
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2010
    Nothing.

    You can try a strong NDA, but those rarely have any enforcement power behind them except after-the-fact. It will be very difficult to, say, get an injunction (if that person is even located in an area under jurisdiction) in time before a game is published, and it will cost time and money even in the best-case court scenario.

    The best way to avoid a third party coming out with your game before you do is to compartmentalize responsibility.

    For instance, if you hire a freelance artist, you simply describe storyline (not gameplay mechanics), and a "look" you are going for. The character artist doesn't need to know that you are using a revolutionary new slide-command menu, or that you are integrating a new game mechanic that is fun and addictive. It seems rather cold to leave those working on the game in the dark (and it can certainly effect the overall "gel" of the game if they don't know exactly what it's for), but that is the only zero-risk way.

    I have seen countless developers blindsided by being overly trusting. I have similarly seen other developers ruin a potentially fun game by keeping all the specifics under lock and key and basically ordering an army of freelancers to work in the dark with information specific to each one, Manhattan-project style.

    I enjoy free-market incentives. Give the freelancers complete access to your idea, and a payment structure that is a % of game profits. This is a great motivational strategy and minimizes the temptation to make a competing rip-off (he/they would be cutting in to the profits that otherwise could have been made if your game was a success).

    The real issue with this (and it is a big one) is that much fewer are willing to take on a project with the promise of pay tied to the final performance of the project. However, these doubts that programmers / artists etc. may have regarding the potential success of your game may be a reflection upon their own subconscious (or conscious) understanding of the quality of their own work. It is my experience that the adventurous, self-confident generally has every reason to be so. If they believe that much in themselves, they are likely good choices. Thoughts?
     
  15. mr.Ugly

    mr.Ugly Well-Known Member

    Dec 1, 2009
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    can you give some examples where freelancers run off with the stuff entrusted to them? i have yet to hear about someone stealing someone elses "idea"

    a freelancer is rather charging hourly rates where he does actualy do nothing.. or minimal work..

    if someone wants to scam you he is more interested in your money than your ideas.
     

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