best way to market

interesting turn of discussion in this thread

I absolutely see no harm in getting your friends to help build up fake reviews for a game, at this point. I mean - personally I have not done it that way (I asked people to review my game, but stressed that they should be honest) and really unless you have like 500 friends, then getting enough reviews to really make any kind of impact these days is honestly fairly negligible anyway. Be it on iTunes, a forum, etc. People will see and judge you for what your product looks like anyway, and whether it's got anything genuinely going for it (to the point that a bigger website might give it some higher-profile coverage). And for that you'll need a good bit of money/connections to "buy," otherwise..

 

A key point that is missing is very few games on the app store make money.

From personal example, my last game, Hard8 has been well reviewed, it got a front page very positive review here on TA, it has been reviewed in 4-5 other places, it was featured by Apple in New and Noteworthy and What's Hot and has a 4.5 to 5 star rating in iTunes.

If you took the money the game has made and divided by the profit generated, my time spent on it would have been about $1 a hour. Over time that number will increase of course, but it's going to be slow going.

Therefore making a game because you think it will make money for you is the not the right thing to do.

Make games because you love to make games and enjoy making them. Then when finished do the things to promote it that Ron and others have talked about. BUT - still keep the expectation that it is not going to make money. IE - Don't quit your day job...

 

Just looked at Hard8, looks great congrats It's sad that such a great looking game is not selling as well as you hoped It's really suprising given all the positive feedback and exposure you got. Was it just a case of you got loads of downloads at the start then they spiralled off or was it more of a slow and steady amount of sales?

Sorry for all the questions, but in terms of the TA review, did you just make a post in upcoming games or did you do anything on top of that?

Thanks

 

You're absolutely right however, I think you're missing my point a bit. The purpose behind getting to know these ppl and showing them that you pay attention to their work isn't to get a review, it's simply to add value to your pitch thus setting yourself apart from the rest. As far as actually getting reviewed, it's down to their decision...always.

 

-Change your artwork. You can't tell it's even a shark. Maybe have a more cartoony looking shark, fish and squid.
-Change your icon. Many people won't even click on your game because of it
-Get rid of that blurry video. It's most likely turning people away even if they were considering your game. People relate your effort put into the video to the effort you put into the game.

You need to look at this from the buyer's point of view. There's nothing I can see that is making me want to spend my money on this game. As soon as I see the icon I wouldn't click on it. Your first screenshot has a large blurry shark on it as if you took a small image and blew it up too large. I bet you are losing more sales on first impression than anything else.

 

Well, I think there's a difference between understanding the needs of a website and becoming friends with the editors.

Example... I've emailed this website with exclusives... like an Ad-Hoc version of BOT or information about secret cheat codes in my game. I consider that ethical. The cheat codes could be reported as news and pre-release copies of media is common in the journalism biz. It's like movies or books. Publications have to meet deadlines, so it's not unusual to send early copies of a book, movie or game so that the launch of a review is the same day as the launch of the thing being reviewed.

I understand that a review website has to maintain and expand their readership, so the game has to match the website. I don't expect Touch Arcade to review the Mac version of BOT, as this site is mostly about iOS games. Yet, I have communicated with the editors of this website about my other apps. I'd describe that dialogue as professional rather than friendly.

Have any of my apps been reviewed on this website? No.

...but if they do decide to review my apps one day, it will be an honest review — not because I'm buddy-buddy with the editors.

 

Sure... but just because you have a professional relationship, doesn't mean you can't make a new friend and just because he is a friend, doesn't mean you won't get an honest review. Difference in opinion I guess either way, at the end of the day, we need publicity or we're screwed LOL.

 

probably not the best place for me to post this stuff, since it's degenerating into another one of those "people want to examine why their apps aren't making (or can't make) money," but since it's right up the alley with where the discussion is headed anyway..

I guess it can never be stressed enough, although it will continue to fall on deaf ears for a long time yet. Just because you made an app, just because it looks decent, just because you and your friends might like it, this doesn't mean anyone outside of that circle will ever care. This is the harsh reality and one so many devs don't want to face. There's a few things working against all of us: there's just wayyyyy too much competition, even if you do get some decent coverage it's fast becoming negligible - the other being that you are now directly competing with powerhouse devs who not only have the brute force to make compelling unrealEngine-powered experiences, but they are working hard to maintain the higher positions on the charts.

Not only from the tech and name-brand end of things, but also on the marketing and promotion end of things. Does anyone know how much it costs to effectively market something "legitimately?" Way more than any independent developer would ever want to spend (like. millions of dollars). Yeah, you can buy banner ads at X,Y, and Z "niche" websites but that's not going to get anywhere near enough clicks to earn back what you've paid anyway.

If you can't come with a game that looks like Infinity Blade then the enthusiast press generally won't give you more than a passing nod, if you are lucky. This doesn't mean IB is the be-all end-all game for iOS (hell, it's not even an appropriate game for the larger market). If developers want to get serious about making any headway in this realm - as a potential money-maker, as opposed to hobby - a lot of energy and enthusiasm must be put down in the marketing dep't before the app idea has even taken shape. Always know what you are up against, what you'll be compared to, what kind of visibility you could get and what that means. Be prepared to be judged by yoru name/icon alone before someone even bothers with a screenshot. There's a lot of brilliant resource out there to learn from, but one really needs to throw themselves into it and just get used to thinking in those terms "marketing is more important than the actual product" if you want to make money.

pant, pant.

 

Wow... what if the friendship happens naturally, with no intent to receive biased reviews? That's an interesting ethical dilemma.

I write game reviews. I've even reviewed some GameSalad games. And when I do, I'm brutal. I post a full-disclosure disclaimer, letting people know if I received a promo code or if there's any reason why someone might suspect bias. Here's an example...

http://photics.com/tigerfish-review

Am I friends with the developer? Not really, but I did feel bad having to write bad things about the game. Yet, that's my role as a reviewer. I think developers should respect that.

If you become friends with the editors naturally, that might be OK — if the editors still write ethical reviews. (If I was writing a review about a game a friend of mine made, I think that I'd probably mention it in the review. Instead of downplaying the fact, I'd make it part of the review.) Journalists don't live in a bubble, so they are influenced by the world around them. The differences is that journalists should stick to the facts. If your mission is to become friends with editors so that you can get better reviews, I think that's bad. It's phoney and that's not what journalism should be about. It doesn't help developers either.

Tiny Wings is an example of a highly successful app with pretty much no marketing. It's a good game and people like good games. I think that's the best marketing around. By getting honest feedback, developers can build better games. So even though it's great to get noticed in the press, it shouldn't be at the expense of honest reviews.

I'm not trying to lecture anyone. This is just the way I do business. Some people might think, "Dude, you're a naive fool... and that's why BOT went nowhere." ...but I think that the App Store is pretty good. It's not perfect, but it seems to reward hard work and good apps.

• I still think the best marketing is getting featured by Apple.
• Apple features good games!
• So, I try to build good games to get featured.

Some launch day marketing is good to help create a surge, like mailing lists and promo codes for review sites. If you're into Twitter/Facebook, that might be cool too. I'm also considering some paid advertisement, but that doesn't seem to work as well as it should.

 

I do think that big game companies are a threat to independent developers, but that's nothing new. I think now is still a great time to be an independent developer. The top iTunes games generally are not 3D games...

Tiny Wings, Cut The Rope, Angry Birds... even Fruit Ninja could be accomplished with just 2D. The biggest games around - CityVille and FarmVille are just isometric games.

I think it's a bad idea to fight the big companies directly. That means staying clear of major holidays and Apple hardware launches. The big companies lower the prices of their games and it's even harder to get noticed with all the sales going on. But even with that, I still see lots of opportunity for independent developers.

If I wasn't making apps, I'd probably be wasting my time playing Guild Wars or some other online game. So instead of trying to get virtual loot, the reward is real on the App Store. I don't win every battle, but I do learn and my apps get better.

 

Sorry but Tiny wing have 0$ budget marketing, but they spend weeks to market their game. They wrote to most app review web site and they did a promo kickass video.
If they ask an exterior contractor to do this job, that would have probably cost them around 15-20 000$.

Zero $ marketing budget don't mean Zero marketing.

It's like building your house by yourself. It's just a lot cheaper but you still have to get your hands dirty.

Apple feature games... they saw!!
Apple use website like touch arcade to choose games they will feature.
That's why it's so important to be on Touch Arcade.

 

Sorry but I just looked at your iTunes page for the game and here's some feedback:

Call it Lucky Shark not Lucky_Shark - just looks a bit strange.

Your icon is blurry and you can't see what it is really - not eyecatching at all.

Your description is also in need of a serious shakeup. I would happily re-write you a small one due to my desire for all indies to succeed.

On your second screenshot, it says score and then underneath Death. One is capitalized and one isn't - doesn't look very professional

Why is the F in Facebook on the last screenshot blue? And you have spelt Menu wrong

Please don't think I'm having a go, I'm just trying to help

 

3HXYFRRPL93T taken thanks

 

I write to the review sites with almost every app launch that I do. Even today, with the launch of BOT for the iPad, I sent out a bunch of emails to review sites.

In addition to marketing the app, I actually discussed the development of BOT for months before the game launched...

Here...
http://gamesalad.com/forums/topic.php?id=15896

...and here...
http://forums.toucharcade.com/showthread.php?t=86586

I think the game is great, but the feedback is mixed. Some people love it and some people hate it. Tiny Wings is a great game for iOS. It appeals to a larger audience and it's easy to play.

I don't remember the promo video for Tiny Wings. I remember reading about it on Touch Arcade, with someone showing a video of the game being played rather poorly. People liked the game so they started discussing it.

I still think that the main reason for the success of Tiny Wings is that it's a well-liked game.