iPad Astral: Origin (by Yangxi Zhou)

Discussion in 'iPhone and iPad Games' started by IncomingGames, Sep 12, 2015.

  1. chief78

    chief78 Well-Known Member

    Jul 24, 2012
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    Played a bit more and I agree with Deadcandance that the lane switch feels clunky. The character feels like he should be changing lanes quicker, and it is causing enough runs to be ended quickly. I finally figured out you can tap anywhere on the screen to trigger an attack, so that is not an issue anymore. The way the tutorial highlights the enemy and shows a finger tapping on the enemy was misleading, but since you don't have to do this, it works fine.

    I would suggest just having a finger touching another part of the screen, as not to infer you must tap the enemy to attack them. Otherwise, quicker lane switching would be very welcome, and give the controls that "crisp" feeling Dead is talking about. I will say though, i see the amount of energy to play a level increasing as I progress further into the game, and I definitely see hitting a point of frustration because of the energy system.

    I'm thinking of the perfect balance that Pac-man 256 accomplished. Make the game free, and let the F2P players deal with timers. But also provide an IAP so those of us who don't want or care for timers can pay to remove them. If you have to go ad based on the F2P side, so be it, as long as the premium version allows for the IAP to remove ads or make them strictly optional (like a "watch this add for extra currency").
     
  2. Zeillusion

    Zeillusion Well-Known Member

    Sep 30, 2013
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    #42 Zeillusion, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    Sweet, you wrote a paragraph about how you favor f2p because it's no different than arcade machines. Guess what bro.. Those machines didn't allow 50-100$ worth of IAP. Those machines also didn't use mind altering tactics to pressure you into spending countless amounts of money on silly digital locked content.

    It was straight up. Put 3 quarters in and play until you die. It was a pass time, before a movie you'd hit up street fighter or zombie smoker 3. Maybe with a few friends you'd hit the arcade on the boardwalk. You'd walk out spending 10-15$, having had a ton of fun with your friends. They were also experiences. Using plastic guns or props, or a giant virtual reality helmet to cause mayhem.

    Mobile gaming is a ton different. These games aren't meant to play for a few minutes. Most are long term, could be rpg, could be card games. They are meant to be PLAYED. They have competitive online events, special prizes to top players, leaderboards, daily rewards, daily activities ect. Once again, they are MEANT to be played.

    They also lock you completely out unless you gamble tons of money. Check these forums out. You'll see all different types of games. People spending hundreds upon hundreds trying to achieve certain items, ect.

    Free mobile games are actually a TON different than arcade machines. Now of course some developers actually dispise IAP but recognize that's the only way to make money. So they'll make a game that's not intrusive or absolutely cruel. You'll shell out a few bucks or so to unlock a full experience. But that... Is rare.

    8 out of 10 times mobile free to play games are morally unacceptable.

    Anyways, I just threw down for this game since its looks interesting. Will have to check it out.

    I thought it was premium, the description leads you to believe it's different than those who are commenting are saying.

    Edit: I'm referring to the guy that called out some forum goers for giving constructive criticism.

    The devs seem real genuine, my advice would be to remove the price tag, because having an energy system inside a paid game is disappointing. You guys are a new company and its you first game so assuming you want the energy system in, making it free would be a good option. More players will try it out as a result.
     
  3. chief78

    chief78 Well-Known Member

    Jul 24, 2012
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    #43 chief78, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    WTF?? Do you even know what you say, or do you just talk $#!+ because you're that ignorant? So where's your review and feedback then?
     
  4. diaskeaus

    diaskeaus Well-Known Member

    Feb 12, 2013
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    I bought this game. It's really fun but unnecessarily difficult, especially when the enemies start piling up on you and are hitting you for a quarter of your health each time. Some suggestions:

    1. Either set a difficulty level that scales up your rewards or scales down the rewards depending on how high or low it is,

    2. Lower your energy requirement. It's ridiculously high (6 per try) and remove energy expenditure from dying (also remove astral gained unless you lower the energy to 1 or something),

    3. Create a wider attack area for killing enemies with your sword (killing baddies in a runner should feel invigorating, not taxing -- see the game Brim for an example),

    4. Reduce drag on changing lanes,

    5. Increase radius of dive attack (as it stands if you make a small error in judgement you have to restart level from just one group of enemies given how hard they hit you),

    6. And reduce cost of armor items in the store as they are generally unrealistic (you go from 2,000 to 50,000 in just one mission) or release additional types of armor between already existing armor which reduces enemy attack power against you.

    7. One last thing: I have found a typo - when you go to the Crystal Contracts, it says you can 'wacth' some ads instead of 'watch' some ads. There may be more but I wanted to post immediately with the previous comments before the discussion gets too detailed on IAP and pricing. The only thing I have to add to this is you probably should only charge money for one currency and not two. Don't allow people to buy astrals, just allow them to buy star crystals but make sure you allow people the opportunity to find star crystals in the game as a rare item while running. $25 is insane and will earn you no friends when that is the price of a single piece of armor in your game. Tread warily -- the international market is not as forgiving as China when it comes to IAP pricing and generally people in the international market will actually pay your prices (albeit reluctantly) so pick your battles and create trust.
     
  5. rayray307

    rayray307 New Member

    May 30, 2014
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    Hard as ####...got to a boss level and it was so damn hard to dash into the lane u need to be in w.o knowing what is up ahead, like my charachter decided to start running backwards.
     
  6. deadcandance

    deadcandance Well-Known Member

    Jan 18, 2013
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    Beenlaying more. Yea tapping anywhere helps. Energy system I can start to see will reach annoying level. I say make it free keep energy with option to pay to remove. Problem I'm honestly seeing now having played so many good runners and being such a huge fan of the genre is that this game for me is just not as engaging or interesting Nothing shockingly new. And nothing that hasn't been done better. Run and gun, amazing runner, temple runs, agent dash, pitfall, rry
     
  7. deadcandance

    deadcandance Well-Known Member

    Jan 18, 2013
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    And boson x and subway surfer I compare every runner to these and it just falls short. The lane change response is a game killer is this. Graphics are very cute just not great. Color pallette is washed out looking. Very simple. Just hard for all the wrong reasons. Good try though devs. It doesn't suck just uninspired
     
  8. Repulsa

    Repulsa Well-Known Member

    Jul 3, 2015
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    Gotta say this guy really has a point and here's what it made me realize... None of those games are worth the hundreds of dollars people throw down. Are any of those games on a par with console games that people pay $40 and up for? No not one of them is yet people are paying more then they pay for the latest console game. I think we should raise the bar, make these games more worthy of our money and charge one heftier premium price for them. If a game is worth the price you bet I'll pay it. But throwing away hundreds on these f2p mmorpgs and ccgs? That's insanity.
     
  9. duh_d_dum

    duh_d_dum Active Member

    Nov 3, 2012
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    #49 duh_d_dum, Sep 12, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2015
    Yea I agree that boss stage is kinda crazy. I don't like not knowing what's in front of me especially if I'm trying to get the 3 stars.

    EDIT: Actually it isn't that hard once I realized the majority of the time I just needed to stay in the middle lane and jump, then occasionally move to the right.
     
  10. diaskeaus

    diaskeaus Well-Known Member

    Feb 12, 2013
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    A couple more comments after playing this morning:

    1. I went through an entire 120 energy bar in literally 10 minutes. It takes around 2.5 minutes to refresh one energy (giving a 5 hour refresh rate), so at the moment this game is going to be deleted from my phone for the same reason that so many games are deleted. I'm not very good at runners (but I love well-made ones) so punishing me and not allowing me to play because I suck means unfortunately I can't play it just the way the system is built.

    2. It really does feel like a hardcore game using a freemium model. Freemium games are known in the business for being really easy (low gateway of skill which increases at a very slow margin), while hardcore games have options for people to die over and over again and thereby gain skill. This game is built with the intention for you to die over and over until you 'get' it without the option to actually do it without spending a ton of money.

    3. There is a huge amount of strategy to the game that comes with the daily quests. If you are good at the game and plan out what you are doing you could excel very quickly just by completing daily quests. However, with the sheer amount of deaths that come in such short spurts most of these seem currently unattainable.

    I really think the design is wonderful but the actual gameplay is a bit discouraging. I've got so many other great and innovative runners right now (Brim, Relic Run, Spider-Man Unlimited, Alto Adventure, Breakneck) that it's unrealistic this game will join those any time soon without some massive changes. Of course, after playing the game for a day or so, the way it was designed it's clear I'm not the intended audience.
     
  11. IncomingGames

    IncomingGames Well-Known Member

    Aug 17, 2015
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    Thanks for all the comments!

    Dear guys,

    First of all, we really appreciate for all the comments(no matter negative and positive) about our game, we scanned all the comments and please forgive us that we cannot reply immediately (our team has only 4 guys, what's worse, two guys' English really sucks.) But we will reply your comments continuously cause we can see you really want to help this game become better.

    We stayed up for a whole night and submitted one new version and request the Appstore for rush review, the new version solves the following problems:
    1. Swipe control is much smoother. Your fingers don't have to leave screen to trigger actions.
    2. Increased the attack area of characters.
    3. Some minor problems.
    If there is no any delay and or other issues, the new version may come very soon.

    As for the gameplay,some said it's hard and cannot figure out how to pass it,some mentioned other problems of our gameplay. Trust us, we will post more replys about our gameplay design continuosly. In the coming days we let you guys know the reason why we design them in this way and we want to share more things about the design,the gameplay,more about our game.

    At last,we want all of you to know,you guys are so amazing,so supportive(we never experienced this before in China). It's our first game as well as the first time to show our game on TA,so we really want to make our game better by listening carefully to the feedback and become friends with all of you.

    Thanks again!

    PS: For those who want to try it immediately, we still have some promo code, so you can contact us by email([email protected])and we will send it to you. As for the energy system, it needs some time to fix it and we're still on the way, you can tell any idea or suggestion about it and we'll listen carefully to your opinions, definitely.
     
  12. IncomingGames

    IncomingGames Well-Known Member

    Aug 17, 2015
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    #52 IncomingGames, Sep 13, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2015
    Cheif, Thanks so mucn!

    Yeah, other players also mentioned the same problem as you just said and we already realized it. It will be fixed in v1.0.2 which will be released in a few days. At current state, here is a tips: You must lift your finger out of screen to trigger actions, if your finger still touching the screen, the input commands won't trigger at all.

    Besides, we also want to say, at the start, you may feel a little difficult and uncomfatble with the control(Because it's new an rear, not much runner requires so many inputs and strategies). But we hope you can spend a little more time on it, once you get a little used to it and you'll also find our level design is truly unique and intriguing(I swear.) Don't give up easily, take a deep try on it if you like.

    Anyway,we really appreciate for your obejective comment and you're so nice. Thanks again!
     
  13. IncomingGames

    IncomingGames Well-Known Member

    Aug 17, 2015
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    Thanks so much!

    We're so glad we received the first Chinese comment and we want you to know we feel so grateful and moved for your support. We have to admit we do lack of experience and we already realized the problem of localiztion. We're figuring out one proper way to fix them and we're on the way to make this game better. Thanks for your support again, hope you 'll keep an eye on our updates and tell us your any idea! 谢谢!:)
     
  14. IncomingGames

    IncomingGames Well-Known Member

    Aug 17, 2015
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    Boss battle is difficult, indeed.

    Boss battle is really difficult, but not so difficult anymore once you learn how to take use of those hovering-attacks, armors or items... To be honest, when we first play the boss battle, we also find a little difficult to pass it, but after some a few rounds of practice, we don't think so. What's more, we really enjoy the huge pleasure of passing the boss battle successfully.

    We will keep listening to your opionions and maybe later we can post some short lectures to share how to pass the boss battle.

    Thanks so much!
     
  15. Shifaan

    Shifaan Well-Known Member

    Jul 27, 2013
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    I'm not sure if this'll work but if I were a developer then I'd give it a shot. Try to go for removing the timer instead of reverting to the free-to-play option. A paid endless-runner without a timer would probably attract more attention as it isn't very often you find a runner game like that. Having it free-to-play with a timer is just typical and many people will overlook it. I personally wasn't interested until I saw the $1.29 price tag and now it's gone on my watch list. But then again I could be wrong, so this is just an idea ;)
    Best of luck with your game, it looks really nice.
     
  16. IncomingGames

    IncomingGames Well-Known Member

    Aug 17, 2015
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    The price tag will be removed, so is the energy system. But right now isn't the best time to set it free for there is some bug fixing works to do. If we set it free now, may be we will cause a very bad impression to those new players. We think the best time to do it is when the new version v1.0.2 released(We already submitted it, still waiting for Apple's review).

    In the new version, we changed the way input commands triggered just like any other runners, and increased both the attack area and attack collision check duration. In that case, the difficulty of this game will drop to an ordinary level.

    However, removing the energy system requires extra coding works. It will be handled in v1.0.3. We are working very hard on this and many other improvements.

    Thanks for your reply.
     
  17. Shifaan

    Shifaan Well-Known Member

    Jul 27, 2013
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    Whatever suits you best, I look forward to it #
     
  18. IncomingGames

    IncomingGames Well-Known Member

    Aug 17, 2015
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  19. morpheus

    morpheus Active Member

    Mar 15, 2011
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    The top grossing games in all categories worldwide are freemium, so this statement is clearly wrong as freemium energy games are wildly popular.

    Unfortunately for indie devs there are no good options:

    - Premium titles for a buck or two rarely sell more than a few thousand copies, so you lose money.

    - Freemium titles require a huge marketing budget, an Apple feature or a miracle to make it to a big enough audience.

    Many of the suggestions here are proven not to work e.g. Splitting one title into separate freemium and premium versions cuts your audience and chart ranking in half as well as compromising the game design.

    Selling an ultimate IAP to unlock everything or disable ads doesn't work either because the conversion rate is too low, and it caps your maximum spend in the game.

    Mobile game development is not a fun place to be right now.
     
  20. sine909

    sine909 Active Member

    Nov 20, 2010
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    #60 sine909, Sep 13, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2015
    You're right that mobile is rough - but their goal shouldn't be a top grossing game. It's unecessary, unrealistic, and the competition is far too rough (well funded, licensed properties, etc).

    Also while it's true that most (not all) top grossing are freemium, they don't all use energy to do it - it's just something that works well in some categories (I don't recall classic runners, like jet pack joyride or newer ones like crossy road using energy).

    The idea that a runner which is premium that could be appreciated by enough of an audience for a reasonable level of success is sound, but I think either no energy (get more creative), or free with an IAP to remove energy are incredibly viable strategies to experiment with - and measured experimentation is far more valid than hoping for viral/luck.

    Also, you don't need one unlock to unlock everything and cap spend - games have found great success with more creative endevours.

    Regardless these ideas are no less risky than trying to go head to head with clash of clans - which is the unfortunate mistake that most developers do which leads to the terrible mobile economic stats everyone quotes.

    Finally you don't need to chart to "succeed". These guys are a Chinese developer, likely with low costs. A sustained and slowly growing player base wouldn't chart, but it very well could fund their future opportunities and allow them to keep making games - which is hopefully their passion.

    Basically the tone of your message was (as I read it) "just give up" or, best case, "do what the big guys do", which probably isn't the best option for these guys at this moment.
     

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